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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 2nd August 2007, 06:33 AM
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Re: The matter is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rhys
Let's take a poll. Which do you guys is more valuable. Having 99% market share of a browser or selling legitimate copies of an operating system?

The conclusion you draw is your own.

On a long term strategic perspective, 99% of market share of a browser is more important than anything else.

If firefox gets a foothold and google takes control over firefox, sometime in the future, don't know when, maybe 20 years later, the OS will not be relevant. The mac already poses a great threat if Apple and Google and Firefox forms an alliance.

Selling legitimate copies of an OS can be enforced through many other means.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 2nd August 2007, 07:05 AM
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Re: The matter is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rhys
Let's take a poll. Which do you guys is more valuable. Having 99% market share of a browser or selling legitimate copies of an operating system?

The conclusion you draw is your own.
Now that's a difficult one. But the thing is that nobody has 99% market share of a browser. I don't know about asia, but across europe the stats are as low as 55% in some countries with 70% being the average. And ground is being lost every day... Denial is not just a river in Egypt.

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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 2nd August 2007, 07:14 AM
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Re: The matter is.

The IE market share in Asia is extremely high, but because of this, microsoft sees no need to rush out IE7. Hence, no auto.

I wasn't surprised that they will drag their feet in Asia, given the reactive approach in what microsoft do - they always react only when the problem comes. They are doing too many businesses, management is losing focus, they got other more pressing issues than IE7.

As for Vista, it's betaware with respect to downward compatibility to previous Windows applications (compatibility is a big issue, and it costs money to buy updates for 3rd party software), so i can't see how it can replace WinXP in the short term.

IDN will take off when most browsers are compatible, and this day will come sooner or later, it doesn't matter if they are mostly Firefox or mostly IE7.

Mainframes in the 1970s only supported english/ascii, and scientists in Japan did not lose the ability to type Japanese when PCs start supporting Kana.

Last edited by touchring; 2nd August 2007 at 07:38 AM..
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 2nd August 2007, 09:22 AM
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Re: The matter is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by touchring
IDN will take off when most browsers are compatible, and this day will come sooner or later, it doesn't matter if they are mostly Firefox or mostly IE7.
They definitely aren't taking off "sooner", and Firefox's "holier than though" whitelisting policy doesn't help the situation as much as it pains me to say it because I thoroughly detest all manner of Micros~1 (the company, not the people).

Still, just because "IDN takes off", it doesn't mean that people are going to get rich by having thousands of parked domains. Development will always be the key - think about germany.com and the stupid cat, what a waste of real-estate. OK, there are two ads on the page now...

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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 2nd August 2007, 09:36 AM
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Re: The matter is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by touchring
On a long term strategic perspective, 99% of market share of a browser is more important than anything else.

If firefox gets a foothold and google takes control over firefox, sometime in the future, don't know when, maybe 20 years later, the OS will not be relevant. The mac already poses a great threat if Apple and Google and Firefox forms an alliance.

Selling legitimate copies of an OS can be enforced through many other means.
I would say that you are exactly right Touch. The conclusion we should draw from this is that Microsoft will probably make the smartest choice for itself in China but it will probably just take a bit more time to sort itself out before we get what we want.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 2nd August 2007, 09:37 AM
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Re: The matter is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jacksonm
They definitely aren't taking off "sooner", and Firefox's "holier than though" whitelisting policy doesn't help the situation as much as it pains me to say it because I thoroughly detest all manner of Micros~1 (the company, not the people).

Still, just because "IDN takes off", it doesn't mean that people are going to get rich by having thousands of parked domains. Development will always be the key - think about germany.com and the stupid cat, what a waste of real-estate. OK, there are two ads on the page now...

.


There's no need for development when the time comes. Webmasters just start switching to IDNs.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 2nd August 2007, 10:31 AM
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Re: The matter is.

He does have a point - their will be a small lag in the introduction of IE7 and users in China having the functions of it (the launch date + 3 months is what we should all be looking for).

I also am seeing cracked / cloned versions of IE being more prominent than the original.
Companies have picked up on the idea that browsers are king - and every man and their dog has put one out (and like elsewhere people generally use what they get with the PC when they buy it or is loaded when they get their internet connection).

However, saying this, they will crack and clone IE7 once it is fully using a Chinese system / text menus (just their will be a few months lag as people do this). Assuming that IE7 Chinese version has fixed the font issue they presently have on the English version... otherwise it might be binned in place of Firefox, Opera etc. - maybe that is a jump, but if that issue is not fixed, we might be in for a wait).

Also with the set-up of Firefox and Opera offices in China, we should see some more partnerships which results in their browsers appearing on PCs, PDAs etc.
For example the Opera joint venture we saw in another post recently (mobile browser), is the edge of what will jump forward quickly I suspect.
Interested to see that Safari at last has launched a Chinese version of their browser - it will be interesting to see if people start seeing more hits from this and browsers apart from IE over the next 6 months (I sent the link to a few people and am waiting to see when I visit them next time, if they are using it or not).

But do give the guy who started this post some credit - he has identified an issue that many in the forum were not aware of (namely IE cloned is presently probably king and not IE).

Cheers, Asiaplay

PS: I also have no worries on the hardware side - this will from now on continue to be ahead of the "average" in the West due to cheaper prices in China. Companies I deal with often throw away their PC and buy a new one rather than fix it when it crashes!!!

Last edited by Asiaplay; 2nd August 2007 at 10:38 AM..
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 3rd August 2007, 11:41 AM
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Re: The matter is.

IE7 is IE7 - cracked or real. It gives us what we need.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 3rd August 2007, 11:46 AM
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Re: The matter is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rhys
IE7 is IE7 - cracked or real. It gives us what we need.
Exactly, and besides most people will find out more about browsing when faced with the frustrations of IE7. A lot will simply flip it for FF or Safari.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 3rd August 2007, 01:30 PM
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Re: The matter is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubber Duck
Exactly, and besides most people will find out more about browsing when faced with the frustrations of IE7. A lot will simply flip it for FF or Safari.
This is true to a degree (agree) - and is exactly why I myself switched to Firefox - as I had just had it up to the eye-balls with IE7 :o .
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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 3rd August 2007, 02:28 PM
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Re: The matter is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asiaplay
This is true to a degree (agree) - and is exactly why I myself switched to Firefox - as I had just had it up to the eye-balls with IE7 .

For some reasons, i think that IE7 is not as good as firefox, maybe it's the new new tab, always displaying an error message. This irritates me. :p

You've opened a new tab


With tabs you can:
Use one Internet Explorer window to view all your webpages.
Open links in a background tab while viewing the page you're on.
Save and open multiple webpages at once by using favorites and home page tabs.


To get started:
Press the CTRL key while clicking links (or use the middle mouse button).
Click any tab with the middle mouse button to close it.
Press ALT+ENTER from the address bar or search box to open the result in a new tab.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 3rd August 2007, 04:27 PM
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Re: The matter is.

How about double clicking the Tab Bar? Or is that just FF?

Quote:
Originally Posted by touchring
For some reasons, i think that IE7 is not as good as firefox, maybe it's the new new tab, always displaying an error message. This irritates me. :p

You've opened a new tab


With tabs you can:
Use one Internet Explorer window to view all your webpages.
Open links in a background tab while viewing the page you're on.
Save and open multiple webpages at once by using favorites and home page tabs.


To get started:
Press the CTRL key while clicking links (or use the middle mouse button).
Click any tab with the middle mouse button to close it.
Press ALT+ENTER from the address bar or search box to open the result in a new tab.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bwhhisc
I am surprised at this response. Most Chinese are not fluent in English, why would they not have an interest in having website names they can read and understand.

And would businesses rather have Chinese website names people can "remember"?
The problem is that when you speak to bi-lingual locals they don't have the same perspective as those that speak no foreign languages. They are rightly proud of their linguistic competence and feel that others should follow their example. This is not only true of Chinese, but Arabic, Hindi and Russian to mention just a few. I admire their endeavour, but despite their local knowledge, their conclusions are often just plain wrong!
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Last edited by Rubber Duck; 3rd August 2007 at 04:31 PM.. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 3rd August 2007, 05:20 PM
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Re: The matter is.

"Microsoft Halves Vista Retail Price in China

BEIJING (Reuters) - Microsoft Corp. has more than halved the retail price of its Vista home basic computer operating software package in China to 499 yuan ($66) from 1,521 yuan, and the price of its premium package to 899 yuan from 1,802 yuan, effective from August 1..." http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/techn...ref=technology

"Lenovo to Sell $199 PC in Rural China
...Dell, based in Round Rock, Texas, announced in March that it will sell a basic desktop PC designed for China and priced at $223-$515...http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/tech...ref=technology

Is there any chance these budget PCs will come with vista/IE7?
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 3rd August 2007, 05:33 PM
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Re: The matter is.

They will come with IE7 even if it is comes entwined with XP.

This appears to be more condescension. Some should be focusing their concerns closer to home:

The 40-year-old I-35W highway bridge, which was being repaired when it collapsed, was not due for replacement until 2020, said Minnesota Governor Tim Pawlenty.

He expressed concern for the rest of the country.

"Anybody who looks at the national picture, the national statistics and says that we don't have a problem would be naive or misleading the situation. We have a major problem," Mr Pawlenty said.

'Crumbling infrastructure'


Experts have estimated the cost of repairing all the nation's bridges at between $55bn (£27.5bn) and $188bn.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/6929241.stm

A Highways Agency spokeswoman said the Minnesota structure was a truss girder bridge, none of which has been identified in England so far.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6929574.stm

Quote:
Originally Posted by dusty
"Microsoft Halves Vista Retail Price in China

BEIJING (Reuters) - Microsoft Corp. has more than halved the retail price of its Vista home basic computer operating software package in China to 499 yuan ($66) from 1,521 yuan, and the price of its premium package to 899 yuan from 1,802 yuan, effective from August 1..." http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/techn...ref=technology

"Lenovo to Sell $199 PC in Rural China
...Dell, based in Round Rock, Texas, announced in March that it will sell a basic desktop PC designed for China and priced at $223-$515...http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/tech...ref=technology

Is there any chance these budget PCs will come with vista/IE7?
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 3rd August 2007, 05:42 PM
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Re: The matter is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dusty
"Microsoft Halves Vista Retail Price in China

BEIJING (Reuters) - Microsoft Corp. has more than halved the retail price of its Vista home basic computer operating software package in China to 499 yuan ($66) from 1,521 yuan, and the price of its premium package to 899 yuan from 1,802 yuan, effective from August 1..." http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/techn...ref=technology

"Lenovo to Sell $199 PC in Rural China
...Dell, based in Round Rock, Texas, announced in March that it will sell a basic desktop PC designed for China and priced at $223-$515...http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/tech...ref=technology

Is there any chance these budget PCs will come with vista/IE7?

I bought a laptop, dual core pentium 1G ram 2 mths ago running vista for my mom, it had nothing installed on it (fresh), and she commented it was very slow. She didn't use it and now it's in the storeroom.

I've got nothing against vista, actually quite like the video game style interface, except it can't run many software, and i don't want to experiment.

Last edited by touchring; 3rd August 2007 at 05:53 PM..
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 3rd August 2007, 05:47 PM
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Re: The matter is.

Quote:
Some should be focusing their concerns closer to home
We'll get right on that. Thanks for the heads up.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 3rd August 2007, 07:03 PM
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Re: The matter is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubber Duck
This appears to be more condescension.
From who?
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