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Old 9th February 2009, 04:03 PM
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Question about ND in China

Potentially a stupid question. Is ND still blocked in China? I have some Chinese idns with an Alexa ranking that receive almost zero traffic.

Second question, if so, is it really worth moving them these days to Dopa, etc?
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Old 9th February 2009, 05:53 PM
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Re: Question about ND in China

Quote:
Originally Posted by idn View Post
Potentially a stupid question. Is ND still blocked in China? I have some Chinese idns with an Alexa ranking that receive almost zero traffic.

Second question, if so, is it really worth moving them these days to Dopa, etc?
I don't think it makes a blind bit of difference. I have tried to explain this 100x before but nobody apparently had been listening. But I will try again.

It is not such much that anythnig is blocked, but the Chinese have introduced a crude hack to make their IDN.IDN work, which means that our traffic get routed in the wrong direction and doesn't resolve. The hack means that anything going through one of the participating ISPs, which is just about everything, has a dot CN appended to anything that has a XN-- in it.

So IDN.IDN (which does not actually exist in the Root) gets redirected to IDN.IDN.CN which actually does exist and pretends to be IDN.IDN. However, IDN.com gets directed to IDN.com.CN, which may or may not exist, but it doesn't get us any advertising revenue as it simply ends up somewhere else.

This is problem has no bearing on who is trying to monetize your traffic. It is just how it is. But when ICANN do what they need to do sometmie in the next millenium, then the hack will no longer be required and it will be removed. Traffic will then start to flow.
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Old 9th February 2009, 06:52 PM
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Re: Question about ND in China

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Originally Posted by Rubber Duck View Post
I don't think it makes a blind bit of difference. I have tried to explain this 100x before but nobody apparently had been listening. But I will try again.

It is not such much that anythnig is blocked, but the Chinese have introduced a crude hack to make their IDN.IDN work, which means that our traffic get routed in the wrong direction and doesn't resolve. The hack means that anything going through one of the participating ISPs, which is just about everything, has a dot CN appended to anything that has a XN-- in it.

So IDN.IDN (which does not actually exist in the Root) gets redirected to IDN.IDN.CN which actually does exist and pretends to be IDN.IDN. However, IDN.com gets directed to IDN.com.CN, which may or may not exist, but it doesn't get us any advertising revenue as it simply ends up somewhere else.

This is problem has no bearing on who is trying to monetize your traffic. It is just how it is. But when ICANN do what they need to do sometmie in the next millenium, then the hack will no longer be required and it will be removed. Traffic will then start to flow.
This should be part of the official IDN fAQ.
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Old 9th February 2009, 10:35 PM
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Re: Question about ND in China

Quote:
So IDN.IDN (which does not actually exist in the Root) gets redirected to IDN.IDN.CN which actually does exist and pretends to be IDN.IDN. However, IDN.com gets directed to IDN.com.CN, which may or may not exist, but it doesn't get us any advertising revenue as it simply ends up somewhere else.
Can't say i have have experienced any of this. No problem accessing .com (no redirect) where i am, also there is no hack in place for IDN.IDN.

Quote:
Potentially a stupid question. Is ND still blocked in China?
Yes, namedrive parking pages are still unreachable for me.
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Old 9th February 2009, 11:17 PM
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Re: Question about ND in China

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Originally Posted by mgrohan View Post
Can't say i have have experienced any of this. No problem accessing .com (no redirect) where i am, also there is no hack in place for IDN.IDN.
Well in that case you must either believe that IDN.IDN already exists within the ICANN root, or that the Chinese have set up a parallel root, which they and ICANN deny.
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Old 10th February 2009, 12:41 AM
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Re: Question about ND in China

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Well in that case you must either believe that IDN.IDN already exists within the ICANN root, or that the Chinese have set up a parallel root, which they and ICANN deny.
No, what i meant was IDN.IDN does not resolve at all.

I just get an error page from the ISP (China telecom)
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Old 10th February 2009, 05:38 AM
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Re: Question about ND in China

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Originally Posted by mgrohan View Post
No, what i meant was IDN.IDN does not resolve at all.

I just get an error page from the ISP (China telecom)
Does this happen with all the browsers?
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Old 10th February 2009, 05:50 AM
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Re: Question about ND in China

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Does this happen with all the browsers?
IE7, FF and Opera - yes.
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Old 10th February 2009, 06:06 AM
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Re: Question about ND in China

I wonder if in general American 'hosting sites' are blocked. Does the Spanish IDNs link in my signature resolve?
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Old 10th February 2009, 06:33 AM
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Re: Question about ND in China

Quote:
Does the Spanish IDNs link in my signature resolve?
I can't access your Spanish IDN site. Other 2 sites in your sig load fine.
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Old 10th February 2009, 06:47 AM
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Re: Question about ND in China

can you access http://www.gryphonhelicopter.com/
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Old 10th February 2009, 07:27 AM
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Re: Question about ND in China

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can you access htt p://w ww . gryphonhelicopter . com/
yes
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Old 10th February 2009, 07:27 AM
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Re: Question about ND in China

Quote:
Originally Posted by mgrohan View Post
No, what i meant was IDN.IDN does not resolve at all.

I just get an error page from the ISP (China telecom)
Which IDN ccTLD's are you trying?

Can you post the URL of the error page you get please?
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Old 11th February 2009, 10:23 AM
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Re: Question about ND in China

Quote:
Which IDN ccTLD's are you trying?
.中国

Quote:
Can you post the URL of the error page you get please?
Actually after a bit more experimenting i was able to load some .中国

e.g. 城市.中国, 您好.中国

But i have some IDN.cn but the .中国 is not working on them. Anyone in China able to give 域名市场.中国 a test.
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Old 11th February 2009, 12:39 PM
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Re: Question about ND in China

Quote:
Originally Posted by mgrohan View Post
.中国



Actually after a bit more experimenting i was able to load some .中国

e.g. 城市.中国, 您好.中国

But i have some IDN.cn but the .中国 is not working on them. Anyone in China able to give 域名市场.中国 a test.
That will be the hack.

There are no DNames sot 城市.中国 is not yet the same as 城市.cn

Whilst when you register you get all the different versions reserved, it is not clear to me that they all resolve. If registering in China you may actually be registering the IDN version, wheras outside you are probably getting the ASCII version.

Any attempt to resolve the ASCII version will probably get you to 城市.cn.cn which doesn't exist. Not sure if 城市.中国 .cn is supported, but I think .Gongsi.cn exists so .Gongsi should resolve, grace of the hack.

It is a complete mess. How the hell the US expect China to expand its internal consumption to save the World economy when their online commerce has is being completely vandalised by the US Commerce Department is beyond me. Seems to me their greed has strangled about the one thing that stands between them and disaster.

Its quite funny really because within months Obama's lot will be begging Beijing to save their sorry asses!
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Old 11th February 2009, 01:13 PM
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Re: Question about ND in China

Quote:
That will be the hack.

There are no DNames sot 城市.中国 is not yet the same as 城市.cn

Whilst when you register you get all the different versions reserved, it is not clear to me that they all resolve. If registering in China you may actually be registering the IDN version, wheras outside you are probably getting the ASCII version.

Any attempt to resolve the ASCII version will probably get you to 城市.cn.cn which doesn't exist. Not sure if 城市.中国 .cn is supported, but I think .Gongsi.cn exists so .Gongsi should resolve, grace of the hack.
IDN.cn (ASCII) all work fine. hadn't been able to get the hack - .中国 working until last night.
As you said though, like most things here it's kind of messy, some don't resolve when they should, and I get firefox errors for others where the ASCII .cn works fine.
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Old 11th February 2009, 06:25 PM
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Re: Question about ND in China

Quote:
Originally Posted by mgrohan View Post
.中国



Actually after a bit more experimenting i was able to load some .中国

e.g. 城市.中国, 您好.中国
# dig @d.dns.cn xn--uis47l.xn--fiqs8s

; <<>> DiG 9.5.0-P2 <<>> @d.dns.cn xn--uis47l.xn--fiqs8s
; (2 servers found)
;; global options: printcmd
;; Got answer:
;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 25194
;; flags: qr rd; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 0, AUTHORITY: 2, ADDITIONAL: 0
;; WARNING: recursion requested but not available

;; QUESTION SECTION:
;xn--uis47l.xn--fiqs8s. IN A

;; AUTHORITY SECTION:
xn--uis47l.xn--fiqs8s. 7200 IN NS pk1.everdns.com.
xn--uis47l.xn--fiqs8s. 7200 IN NS pk2.everdns.com.

##################

# dig @pk1.everdns.com xn--uis47l.xn--fiqs8s

; <<>> DiG 9.5.0-P2 <<>> @pk1.everdns.com xn--uis47l.xn--fiqs8s
; (1 server found)
;; global options: printcmd
;; Got answer:
;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 53278
;; flags: qr aa rd; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 2, AUTHORITY: 2, ADDITIONAL: 4
;; WARNING: recursion requested but not available

;; QUESTION SECTION:
;xn--uis47l.xn--fiqs8s. IN A

;; ANSWER SECTION:
xn--uis47l.xn--fiqs8s. 3600 IN A 124.42.35.181
xn--uis47l.xn--fiqs8s. 3600 IN A 118.102.24.109

;; AUTHORITY SECTION:
. 3600 IN NS hy1.nrparking.com.
. 3600 IN NS hy2.nrparking.com.


That's not a plug-in involved if I can get answers from here just querying DNS.
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Old 12th February 2009, 04:48 AM
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Re: Question about ND in China

When you want to set up a .cn website you have to add all the variant domains to your name server.

Then you can present separate pages for each variant, ie. simplified and traditional.

I suppose you should also and the IDN.IDN version too.
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Old 12th February 2009, 06:39 AM
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Re: Question about ND in China

Quote:
When you want to set up a .cn website you have to add all the variant domains to your name server.

Then you can present separate pages for each variant, ie. simplified and traditional.

I suppose you should also and the IDN.IDN version too.
Think this is most likely what needs to be done, as the other (traditional/simplified) variant i can't get to work either.

Where exactly would you be able to add all the variant domains to your name server?
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Old 12th February 2009, 07:03 AM
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Re: Question about ND in China

Quote:
Originally Posted by blastfromthepast View Post
When you want to set up a .cn website you have to add all the variant domains to your name server.

Then you can present separate pages for each variant, ie. simplified and traditional.

I suppose you should also and the IDN.IDN version too.
ah. So when you assign NS for your idn.cn , CNNIC automatically loads the same NS data into the other zones.

Makes sense.
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