IDN Forums - Internationalized Domain Names  
Home | Advertise on idnforums | Premium Membership

Go Back   IDN Forums - Internationalized Domain Names > IDN Discussions > IDN Domain Appraisals

IDN Domain Appraisals Appraisals by other members on International domain names.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 8th October 2009, 12:57 AM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 15
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
idnfuture is an unknown quantity at this point
Pls appraise 4 Spanish com's JoyeríaDelDiamante, ChicasJóvenes, acciónes, & almacénes

hi,

would someone more knowledgeable please appraise these spanish IDNs?

to my knowledge, all of the marks are on their proper place

should i keep or drop?

JoyeríaDelDiamante.com

ChicasJóvenes.com

acciónes.com

almacénes.com

thank you

Last edited by idnfuture; 8th October 2009 at 01:18 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 8th October 2009, 02:15 AM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 15
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
idnfuture is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: 4 Spanish IDN .com's, pls help: JoyeríaDelDiamante ChicasJóvenes acciónes almacén

based on DomainGuru's interesting post here:

http://www.idnforums.com/forums/2350...ieve-this.html

i think that

ChicasJóvenes.com
JoyeríaDelDiamante.com

are junk?

and also 2 others of mine, junk:

Qè.com
SoftwareEspía.com

am I understanding ICANN is changing the way IDNs work inside applications so these will not be rendered correctly soon?

so these 4 are junk right?

but what about

acciónes.com

and

almacén.com

should i drop these too? thank you
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 8th October 2009, 03:18 AM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Hong Kong / China
Posts: 864
iTrader: (3)
Rep Power: 547
Asiaplay is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: 4 Spanish IDN .com's, pls help: JoyeríaDelDiamante ChicasJóvenes acciónes almacén

Hi IDN Future,

Welcome to the forum.
Just one quick note on Domain Guru's post - this was about special characters that are more unusual for use in a domain name e.g. the heart symbol etc.
Accents (accented letters) used in Spanish are allowed and will remain to be acceptable - so your IDNs are fine from a technical perspective (i.e. will remain to be allowed to be used).

Probably the best way to check the value of Spanish IDNs (and therefore what to keep) is using the following approach.

a) Check ascii verse IDN versions
What a lot of us have found is that people are lazy when typing in Spanish and often use the ascii (English incorrect spelling) of a word, rather than the correct accented version which is as you know the IDN.
You can use google trends to see which version is used most e.g. for your warehouse domain - see here http://www.google.com/trends?q=almac...s%2C+almacenes
You will notice that the ascii version gets almost all of the searches.

b) Check traffic level
You can use google adwords to check traffic level - note that the drop down box for "exact match" is the best choice to use for domains (as it is exact match to a keyword which search engines use).
For example for Spanish / Spain you can use this link:- https://adwords.google.es/select/KeywordToolExternal

If the number of "exact" match searches per month is too low (for country local or Global - whichever you think is the most important) - then the keyword domain or IDN really has little value (only exception sometimes being a word which could be used for a brand that is also a generic word).

c) Use language skills / logic
Some domains / IDNs are good for business use i.e. are likely to be wanted by someone to conduct business using the IDN.
So consider the words themselves and think if they have commercial value (also if they have commercial value over an alternative keyword domain at registration price).

I think by checking these things, you can estimate if your Spanish domains are worth keeping or not.

Hope comments help to some degree - cheers, Asiaplay

PS: myself I tend to invest only in Spanish domains which have higher traffic per month only and these tend to generally be the ascii domains (rather than an IDN) - also as I am not a Spanish speaker, I don't invest very much in them (also as there is a lot of IDNs in oher languages which show more promise for investment for me personally).
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 8th October 2009, 05:36 AM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 15
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
idnfuture is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: 4 Spanish IDN .com's, pls help: JoyeríaDelDiamante ChicasJóvenes acciónes almacén

Thanks for the welcome, and thanks for taking the time to write a detailed response, it is very helpful.

As far as Domain Guru's post, and the IDNA2008 checker, i dont understand what is different about the 5 names of 30 IDN's I ran through the checker and only 5 of them had the black diamond error, "Errors in labels are shown with �".

For example:

http://unicode.org/cldr/utility/idna...ante.com%0D%0A

Why is éa and éq OK, but not qé ?
Why is acciónes and almacénes OK, but not chicasjóvenes, softwareespía, and joyeríadeldiamante ?

My assumption is that my 5 "error" ones must be using a non spanish unicode character in the mix? I dont know, I dont quite get that.

As for the Google Trends, i had thought there was simply never any data on google trends for these IDNs, and because of that i had discounted that as a worthwhile test in the past. but you are saying that this fact is significant in itself and probably warrants dropping IDNs, regardless of whether its naked brother non IDN version has high traffic. is that an accurate summary?

so following your advice:

almacénes .com - miserable 22 global global adwords volume, despite the non IDN version almost 10K global... so almacénes IDN is a junker? Also, the .net version is taken and on sale at sedo for $499. that raised its perceived value to me a bit... and if i drop it, i bet it will be picked up quickly b/c of the .net being taken, but i guess the only one making any $ here is the registrars.

Chicas Jóvenes.com - same thing. "Chicas Jovenes" 5400 global volume, IDN version "not enough data". drop it.

Joyería Del Diamante.com - same thing, not enough data. the funny thing about this one is, i actually rank 6th for this phrase in the google SERPs with a parked page. i think the better phrase for this might be the non IDN "joyas de diamantes", which has 320 in global volume. isn't 320 pretty low for this phrase?

SoftwareEspía.com - 91 global adword volume, and 1600 for the non IDN. So 91 hits is still pretty crappy, i guess...
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 8th October 2009, 08:33 AM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Hong Kong / China
Posts: 864
iTrader: (3)
Rep Power: 547
Asiaplay is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: 4 Spanish IDN .com's, pls help: JoyeríaDelDiamante ChicasJóvenes acciónes almacén

Hi again,

Happy you found my post useful

In regards to Unicode checker - the short answer, is I don't know why!!!
(the results seem strange - as both seem to be thes same accented letter - just word order is different in one case).
Perhaps Point 5 at the bottom of page "The IDNA2008 results need to be updated to the latest context rules" is the reason here???

Yes - Google Trends is a good guide (data seems a good match to reality, for words I have checked across other search engine data e.g. yandex or naver or baidu etc. i.e. graph levels look similar... but once again the only people who know for sure are google themselves - lol).
As an interest comment - some people think the data for google trends is more accurate than google adwords data - but I am not sure if that is true (although I have seen differences in the data between those two tools i.e. they seem to use different data as the basis).

In regards to sedo price...
Unfortunately a sale "price" doesn't mean much - as I can set any price I want for a domain I own... (actual real sales indicate value, offers to sell at xxx price are just interesting info is all... we also see some people offering domains for sale in here, that I think sometimes are too high priced... so I wouldn't use "offer to sell" price as a measure really).

In regards to search volumes to aim for (as a general guide), depending on language I aim between 6K to 30K+ exact match results myself...
Note that good IDN keywords can get millions of exact matches per month for larger population languages like Chinese, Korea, Japanese and some other languages - it is not uncommon to find keywords close to the 1 million mark (so if you look around there are better IDNs still available).

Also IDNs are definitely good for many languages (Spanish is perhaps the general exception for IDNs and to some degree French - as people are lazy and just use ascii letters when searching...
But other languages are outstanding (and in many languages, the keyword in local language has a traffic volume much, much larger than it's English version does or will ever have).

So yes, I wouldn't hold these particular IDNs myself (but that is just my opinion, as a non-spanish speaker) - so please, you choose yourself what you personally think.

Cheers - Asiaplay
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 8th October 2009, 11:54 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 15
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
idnfuture is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: 4 Spanish IDN .com's, pls help: JoyeríaDelDiamante ChicasJóvenes acciónes almacén

thanks for the info.

i dont know what are "Context Rules" are either. Does this perhaps have anything to do with a domain's specified country (told to the registrar upon purchase), vs the unicode characters used within the domain?

The search volumes you state 6K-30K are very interesting.

Is that an ideal sweet spot for searches? ie not too competitive to rank?

I have a bunch of names with 10K-50K, about the same range.

i have some others in lessor tlds with 1M or more...but i think it would take a lot of original content and SEO muscle to rank

most are mine NA or very low....

it makes a lot of sense what you say about spanish/french just typing things in w/o the diacritical mark.

i guess i was banking on very long range appreciation of the actual spelling...but i dont think its worth it anymore.

thanks for your help
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 9th October 2009, 02:27 AM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Hong Kong / China
Posts: 864
iTrader: (3)
Rep Power: 547
Asiaplay is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: 4 Spanish IDN .com's, pls help: JoyeríaDelDiamante ChicasJóvenes acciónes almacén

Hi again,


Context rules, I assumed are things like letter order etc. - but not sure 100%
If you really want to know more follow up with the guys in that thread - main point I was making is that latin accents will remain no problem.

In regards to target volumes, I prefer 60K to 200K for targeting... but in some languages (e.g. Spanish, Italian) - this is not possible, as for some market areas there just is not that level of traffic, even for core industry terms.
So in those cases I will target down to around 6K levels and make an exception to my rule of aiming for more around 30K+.

To be honest, SEO competition is weak in many language markets and it is not that uncommon for people to rank on the 1st page of search engine results with even a single page sometimes (so it is not as hard perhaps as you imagined to rank for some of your IDNs - assuming they have traffic potential)... however, yes, to get returns a bit more development than that is recommened

In regards to typo characters (mixed languages etc.) - yes... I think these are very unlikely to ever get any traffic (learning curve we all go through ).

In regards to lesser TLD (guess you mean ccTLD) - remember that generally these target local results (e.g. mx targets mexico, cn targets China etc.) - so if the local traffic is that level... they are not lesser IDNs (but if you mean other gTLD extentions e.g. .info, .cc etc. - then yes, these are presently hard to sell to investers, as generally they want the ccTLD and/or gTLD .com and maybe the gTLD .net ... past this level, few people will pay too much at the present time).

I hope your IDNs / domains go well - cheers, Asiaplay
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 10th October 2009, 02:33 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 15
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
idnfuture is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: 4 Spanish IDN .com's, pls help: JoyeríaDelDiamante ChicasJóvenes acciónes almacén

very interesting as far as the search volumes. when u say 60-200K, do you like those #s for non IDNs too? for lessor tld's, i was actually referring to some non IDNs. i don't see a subforum here to discuss non idns so i guess that is not encouraged.

anyway thank you again asiaplay for taking the time for such a thorough reply.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 12th October 2009, 02:45 AM
domainguru's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,835
iTrader: (14)
Rep Power: 2515
domainguru has a spectacular aura aboutdomainguru has a spectacular aura aboutdomainguru has a spectacular aura aboutdomainguru has a spectacular aura aboutdomainguru has a spectacular aura aboutdomainguru has a spectacular aura aboutdomainguru has a spectacular aura aboutdomainguru has a spectacular aura aboutdomainguru has a spectacular aura about
Re: 4 Spanish IDN .com's, pls help: JoyeríaDelDiamante ChicasJóvenes acciónes almacén

Quote:
Originally Posted by idnfuture View Post
very interesting as far as the search volumes. when u say 60-200K, do you like those #s for non IDNs too? for lessor tld's, i was actually referring to some non IDNs. i don't see a subforum here to discuss non idns so i guess that is not encouraged.

anyway thank you again asiaplay for taking the time for such a thorough reply.
Don't think anyone is going to throw you out for owning non-IDNs. Quite a few here are guilty of that particular sin. But as for discussing them or not, that's a question of focus really. This forum is focused on IDNs. If you want to discuss other types of domains, plenty of bigger less-focused forums for that ....
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT. The time now is 05:07 AM.

Site Sponsors
Your ad here
buy t-shirt
מחיר הזהב

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0
Copyright idnforums.com 2005

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54