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Old 9th October 2009, 04:08 PM
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Conspiracy?

Why are the majority of well-known domainers dismissive of IDNS?
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Old 9th October 2009, 04:20 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

because they will eventually cost them money via lost earnings!
or they don't understand, or have made their millions and now dont care
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Old 9th October 2009, 04:24 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Agreed, many have missed the boat, (although there are still some decent names out there)
and they are going to lose market share, in the coming months, and years.
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Old 9th October 2009, 04:27 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tee1 View Post
because they will eventually cost them money via lost earnings!
or they don't understand, or have made their millions and now dont care
If the options are either 1) greed vs. 2) ignorance, I'm hoping for the latter.
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Old 9th October 2009, 04:29 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Definitely the latter.
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Old 9th October 2009, 07:40 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

hotel-reservations.com sold $200K plus recently....

hyphen names have been disparaged for years...
lack of type in .....
lack of traffic whatever....

the end user ...the market....branding....and browser capability...

also....50 to 75 % of top domainers make money from typos...
so language or culture means nothing for them to research..


IDN shock commences after Nov 16...at least for Russian / Chinese...
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Old 9th October 2009, 08:47 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sprewellpj View Post
Why are the majority of well-known domainers dismissive of IDNS?

1) US is still the world's largest economy (the European Union isn't a country).

2) Japan (#2), China (#3), and Germany (#4) added together still don't equal the size of the US GDP. To top it, France (#5) must also be added.



But... the chinese and japanese are soon going to have 50 times larger economies than the USA, and they are going to start typing in their IDNS (in dot com, no less) by the billions per day (namedrive will have to relocate to Amazon Data Center), as well chinese advertisers are going to let their budgets be drained, year after year, by foreigner domainers. Germans are going to change preference from dot de to dot com, as well the french are not going to wipo every france related domain in existence.

At least that's the theory.
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Old 9th October 2009, 09:27 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Yes, the Yanks can't even get their head around what constitutes an economy. The Eurozone is an Economy and it is bigger than the US. Britain and others with their own currencies are arguably not sufficiently integrated to be included in the figures, but you don't have to be a "country" to be an economy. It is all about the free movement and exchange of people and assets.

GDP is bollocks in terms of measuring wealth generation. In the case of the US most GDP growth in recent years has only been a measure of how much debt it is getting itself into. Also, the size of an economy is pretty much tied to the valuation of its currency. Only God knows why people are still exchanging goods in return for the Green Back.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jacksonm View Post
1) US is still the world's largest economy (the European Union isn't a country).

2) Japan (#2), China (#3), and Germany (#4) added together still don't equal the size of the US GDP. To top it, France (#5) must also be added.



But... the chinese and japanese are soon going to have 50 times larger economies than the USA, and they are going to start typing in their IDNS (in dot com, no less) by the billions per day (namedrive will have to relocate to Amazon Data Center), as well chinese advertisers are going to let their budgets be drained, year after year, by foreigner domainers. Germans are going to change preference from dot de to dot com, as well the french are not going to wipo every france related domain in existence.

At least that's the theory.
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Old 9th October 2009, 09:45 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jacksonm View Post
1) (the European Union isn't a country).
Rumor, or Rumour has it that the EU will soon have a president, and all countries within the EU will have to supplicate to the laws of the EU. Also rumoured, rumored is that Tony Blair will be the first elected EU president. Anyone else hear this rumour/rumor?

As far as domainers go, most are still into ascii, but with the recent announcements by the DofC and ICANN, I figure many of them have started looking into IDNs. Of course, if they are offshore in the Bahamas, perhaps it doesn't matter to them.
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Old 9th October 2009, 09:48 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by phio View Post
Rumor, or Rumour has it that the EU will soon have a president, and all countries within the EU will have to supplicate to the laws of the EU. Also rumoured, rumored is that Tony Blair will be the first elected EU president. Anyone else hear this rumour/rumor?
Only if the appointment is system is based on that of the Chicago Mafia families!
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Old 9th October 2009, 10:10 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubber Duck View Post
Yes, the Yanks can't even get their head around what constitutes an economy. The Eurozone is an Economy and it is bigger than the US.
The point is that domains target countries, more or less. The Eurozone is 16 countries, with 15 different languages (Austria and Germany arguably sharing the same language). For example, an american might type in "vacationhouses.com", an austrian might type in "ferienhäuser.at", and a german might type "ferienhäuser.de". A relatively small percentage of germans and austrians might type in "ferienhäuser.com". An even smaller percentage might type in "vacationhouses.com" - strong american traffic, plus small traffic from the rest of the civilized world because they all speak english and like to visit the US now and then. But it will be a cold day in hell before americans are going to be typing in "ferienhäuser.de", or anything dot de for that matter, when they are looking to rent a vacation house in germany.
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Old 9th October 2009, 10:29 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jacksonm View Post
it will be a cold day in hell before americans are going to be typing in "ferienhäuser.de", or anything dot de for that matter, when they are looking to rent a vacation house in germany.
"Today about 1.5 million Americans of largely German ancestry claim to speak German as a native or foreign language. Small communities of Amish and Hutterites speak it as a home language up to the present day." source wikipedia.

You may get a few clicks from America. LOL
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Old 9th October 2009, 10:36 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by phio View Post
"Today about 1.5 million Americans of largely German ancestry claim to speak German as a native or foreign language. Small communities of Amish and Hutterites speak it as a home language up to the present day." source wikipedia.

You may get a few clicks from America. LOL

Whatever.

I'd be happy if they'd start speaking dutch...
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Old 9th October 2009, 10:37 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jacksonm View Post
Whatever.

I'd be happy if they'd start speaking dutch...

Do the Amish even own computers?
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Old 9th October 2009, 10:41 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

easy fellows, the Amish produce some nice food products.

sprewellpj I think you get a good idea of why well-known domainers are dismissive of IDNS. IMO what is the most important fact regarding them, the "when" and "how" IDNs take off will have very little to do with them. The train is leaving and they don't even know where the station is
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Old 9th October 2009, 11:09 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sprewellpj View Post
Why are the majority of well-known domainers dismissive of IDNS?
Put yourself in their shoes for a moment.

Lets say you are a famous domainer and you knew that many many people would follow your lead. If you were in acquisition mode buying up the next opportunity ie. IDN's would you tell people about it and therefore increase competition and price or would you be dismissive and reduce interest?
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Old 9th October 2009, 11:24 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jacksonm View Post
The point is that domains target countries, more or less. The Eurozone is 16 countries, with 15 different languages (Austria and Germany arguably sharing the same language). For example, an american might type in "vacationhouses.com", an austrian might type in "ferienhäuser.at", and a german might type "ferienhäuser.de". A relatively small percentage of germans and austrians might type in "ferienhäuser.com". An even smaller percentage might type in "vacationhouses.com" - strong american traffic, plus small traffic from the rest of the civilized world because they all speak english and like to visit the US now and then. But it will be a cold day in hell before americans are going to be typing in "ferienhäuser.de", or anything dot de for that matter, when they are looking to rent a vacation house in germany.
That is fair comment, and I guess it reflects my own domains investment decisions to a large extent. I have tended to focus on languages rather than markets but really only Arabic is spread across distinct economies. Not sure that really matters for type-in but they sure as hell need to be singing from the same hymn sheet.

Whilst we are on the topic, has anyone else noticed increased traffic, increased click through and higher PPC in a prominent IDN language in the last week or two?
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Old 9th October 2009, 11:50 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubber Duck View Post
has anyone else noticed increased traffic, increased click through and higher PPC in a prominent IDN language in the last week or two?
Yes in one language Sept 8 to Oct 8 twice as many traffic/clicks as previous month.
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Old 10th October 2009, 10:44 AM
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Re: Conspiracy?

The thread title was conspiracy, so it's only right I feed that..

I agree, dismissive they are yes.

But (and here comes the conspiracy part) - I have spent the last few weeks mining thousands/ten's of thousands whois records; all as part of my renewal exercise, I use bulk lookup tools to see who has the com of my net, the net of my com, the net of my jp etc etc

while my evidence is purely anecdotal, I can say that I have never seen so much Moniker Privacy in use.

When the time is right, I guarantee you that more than a few "celebrity" domainers will announce their genius in buying up some top idn terms.

If not, i'll eat my hat.

At the same time, should the IDN boat sink somehow, you'll see more than a few "celebrity" domainers will announce their genius in not touching idn.

win-win.
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Old 10th October 2009, 12:01 PM
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Re: Conspiracy?

@Alpha
I agree - there are one or a few new Big Players out there who are being very quiet (probably they are here reading away also, come to think of it).

Japanese drops are being snapped up by someone very professional (automated registrations at literally seconds after the allowed registration time... in one case, they bet my manual application which went in a 3 minutes after the allowed drop registration time!).
It seems that their whole IDN process, from deciding what to buy, to acquistion, is as streamlined and automated as possible (they are basically mass buying up biz generics).

So I agree with Alpha - there must be some of them, playing seriously at IDNing for the last year or so and wisely for their own investment prices also perhaps, keeping very quiet about it.

For the others, they still think an overseas trip means Hawaii (reminds me of one person's horrible dress sense) or to Mexico (to a resort where everyone speaks English still) and seriously think that the world all wants to be like the USA and are learning English super quick to add to their present traffic (that explains the other investors position perhaps).

As we all know... in every type of wide-scale investment.... there are the leaders / entrepreneurs, the copiers and then when the price has risen and it is proved $ can be made... than along come the sheep investors who throw in the combined big $...
At that same time perhaps the big biz spenders arrive, who in this case, will suddenly realise their international internet departments were too focused locally, due to lack of international business exposure or lack of language skills etc. etc. - check out most of the big Western brands... they don't even have websites in languages outside English, let alone an IDN site).

So all is good... the sheep will arrive after someone has shown they made more from IDN development OR on a single IDN sale, than the eqivilant English version of the domain does (i.e. a hotels.com or insure.com IDN story on how an industry in the non-English speaking world was attacked and won... and even more interest, will be shown, if this was done by a non-National, who is a native English speaker... then they will realise it could have been them (and not use the excuse, ohh... not surprising a local did well in that, is only an area a true local with local contacts could have succeeded).

This I must say is happening on a smaller scale already, but so far since this has been for a single language focus, this means it was is in a market smaller than the USA is at present... so no examples of something bigger than an English USA focused domain (i.e. an IDN) yet exists.

However, sometime in the next 5 years, I expect to see some big development hits from either multiple languages for an industry, done using IDNs together to make that big hit OR a single large market big hit, that will wake the USA world (where the majority of investors of English domain are located, sit up and take real interest)... as well as some wealthy local investors in the newer markets, who presently do not understand the power of the internet on business.

We must also remember that English domain value never took off until business success of domain use, showed their was value in domains (and that was also when the majority of the good domains, were well gone).

For now, who cares what they those few think... with the $ they could have behind them to invest, I am actually very happy, that the majority of them are not openly active yet in IDNing or IDN development

Cheers all - Asiaplay
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