IDN Forums - Internationalized Domain Names  
Home | Advertise on idnforums | Premium Membership

Go Back   IDN Forums - Internationalized Domain Names > IDN Discussions > General Discussion

General Discussion Feel free to talk about anything and everything in this board.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 04:28 AM
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 102
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
idncurious is a tad dodgy
what happened to 中国.com?

With the 2 variants of .cn (.中国 and .中國) resolved, I decided to look up whois for 中国.com. To my surprised the result is "not available(variant blocked)"

I don't understand what would caused this domain to become a "variant blocked".

So I did a little more investigating and looked up the whois for 中国.net and 中國.com and they both are registered to someone. Thats even more puzzling. Why would it be possible to register 中国.net and 中國.com but not 中国.com?

The only scenerio I can think of is when a person registered 中国.com but then dropped it, and now no one is allow to registered it. (Correct me if I am wrong, but thats my understanding of how Verisign handles the variant issue.) But that scenerio seems highly unlikely given how valuable this domain is. I just can't believe someone would drop or forget to renew 中国.com

Can anyone think of any reason why this domain is a variant blocked??

Last edited by idncurious; 27th April 2010 at 04:42 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 04:35 AM
squirrel's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,940
iTrader: (11)
Rep Power: 7081
squirrel is a name known to all
squirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to all
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

中國.com blocks 中国.com, that's why it's called a variant block.

http://www.domainavenue.com/ml_variant_in_chinese.htm
http://www.domainavenue.com/ml_variant_solution.htm
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 04:50 AM
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 102
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
idncurious is a tad dodgy
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Quote:
Originally Posted by squirrel View Post
中國.com blocks 中国.com, that's why it's called a variant block.

http://www.domainavenue.com/ml_variant_in_chinese.htm
http://www.domainavenue.com/ml_variant_solution.htm
But here is my question...

Why would someone not register 中国.com back in 2001/2002?

That domain should have been one of the first domains to be registered when idn.com were first made available by Verisign.

Infact, I am almost 100% sure that 中国.com did belong to someone at one time. I do remember doing a whois on that domain many years ago and it did came up with a registrant. (I just forgot the details of who that person is.) I wish I would have written the info down and I could now email that person and find out what happened?

Last edited by idncurious; 27th April 2010 at 04:54 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 05:05 AM
IDNer's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IDNs.pro & IDN.club
Posts: 1,584
iTrader: (38)
Rep Power: 1693
IDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enough
Send a message via MSN to IDNer
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Quote:
Originally Posted by idncurious View Post
But here is my question...

Why would someone not register 中国.com back in 2001/2002?

That domain should have been one of the first domains to be registered when idn.com were first made available by Verisign.

Infact, I am almost 100% sure that 中国.com did belong to someone at one time. I do remember doing a whois on that domain many years ago and it did came up with a registrant. (I just forgot the details of who that person is.) I wish I would have written the info down and I could now email that person and find out what happened?

Not 中国.com, but 中國.com was belongs to a Korean -
and Sedo try to find the buyer on IDNclub.com on 2007 :

http://idnclub.com/showthread.php?t=...D%E5%9C%8B.com
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 06:22 AM
Rubber Duck's Avatar
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Czech Republic (For those of you from USA = Chechnya)
Posts: 15,929
iTrader: (59)
Rep Power: 4508
Rubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura about
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Quote:
Originally Posted by squirrel View Post
中國.com blocks 中国.com, that's why it's called a variant block.

http://www.domainavenue.com/ml_variant_in_chinese.htm
http://www.domainavenue.com/ml_variant_solution.htm
Yes, and the guy with the block will soon have explicit right to both.
__________________
All offers to sell are void.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 06:23 AM
Rubber Duck's Avatar
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Czech Republic (For those of you from USA = Chechnya)
Posts: 15,929
iTrader: (59)
Rep Power: 4508
Rubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura about
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IDNer View Post
Not 中国.com, but 中國.com was belongs to a Korean -
and Sedo try to find the buyer on IDNclub.com on 2007 :

http://idnclub.com/showthread.php?t=...D%E5%9C%8B.com
You should have bought it. it is worth a fortune, or soon will be.
__________________
All offers to sell are void.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 06:40 AM
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 102
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
idncurious is a tad dodgy
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Verisign's variant block rules did not exist for the first few years. I refuse to believe that someone did not register 中国.com in those first few years.

Every Chinese person knows simplified Chinese is infinitely more valuable than traditional Chinese as 1.5 billion in China can't read Traditional Chinese at all.

However, someone registered the traditional .com version but no one register the simplified .com version? Someone registered the .net but not the .com? Does this make sense to you guys???

Something very strange is going on here!

Last edited by idncurious; 27th April 2010 at 06:41 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 06:42 AM
Rubber Duck's Avatar
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Czech Republic (For those of you from USA = Chechnya)
Posts: 15,929
iTrader: (59)
Rep Power: 4508
Rubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura about
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Quote:
Originally Posted by idncurious View Post
Verisign's variant block rules did not exist for the first few years. I refuse to believe that someone did not register 中国.com in those first few years.

Every Chinese person knows simplified Chinese is infinitely more valuable than traditional Chinese as 1.5 billion in China can't read Traditional Chinese at all.

However, someone registered the traditional .com version but no one register the simplified .com version? Someone registered the .net but not the .com? Does this make sense to you guys???

Something very strange is going on here!
You would be astonished what dropped around 2005. If this had dropped then nobody would have been able to catch it. That is why I hang on to my Traditional Chinese.
__________________
All offers to sell are void.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 07:29 AM
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 102
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
idncurious is a tad dodgy
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubber Duck View Post
You would be astonished what dropped around 2005. If this had dropped then nobody would have been able to catch it. That is why I hang on to my Traditional Chinese.
so far this appears to be the most logical explanation. Although I still find it unbelievable that someone would drop 中国.com
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 07:31 AM
IDNer's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IDNs.pro & IDN.club
Posts: 1,584
iTrader: (38)
Rep Power: 1693
IDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enoughIDNer will become famous soon enough
Send a message via MSN to IDNer
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubber Duck View Post
You should have bought it. it is worth a fortune, or soon will be.
I really wish I could... :p
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 07:37 AM
Rubber Duck's Avatar
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Czech Republic (For those of you from USA = Chechnya)
Posts: 15,929
iTrader: (59)
Rep Power: 4508
Rubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura about
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Quote:
Originally Posted by idncurious View Post
so far this appears to be the most logical explanation. Although I still find it unbelievable that someone would drop 中国.com
You would not believe what was dropping, I couldn't and neither could Giant.

The thing was there was no real way of tracking what was dropping until much later, there were no drop services handling them. It was all done by manually registering the punycode. Course the best bit was there were no drop fees. $7 dollar a shot. That is all it took!
__________________
All offers to sell are void.

Last edited by Rubber Duck; 27th April 2010 at 07:40 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 04:00 PM
Clotho's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 765
iTrader: (20)
Rep Power: 1456
Clotho will become famous soon enoughClotho will become famous soon enoughClotho will become famous soon enoughClotho will become famous soon enoughClotho will become famous soon enoughClotho will become famous soon enoughClotho will become famous soon enough
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

中国.com was probably registered by one of the groups that tried to cheat the testbed pre-registration period. Instead of pre-registering with an approved registrar they registered the RACE version of the domain (bq-- etc.) directly prior to Nov. 10/2000. This effectively blocked the domain so nobody else could register it but it placed it outside of the testbed so when the RACE encoded names were migrated to Punycode (bq-- to xn--) they were not included.

Meanwhile somebody registered the Traditional version properly and became the variant owner when the migration actually took place.


The other possibility is that 中国.com was one of those rare domains that the early software mangled and therefore was not registrable at the time. There weren't many of these so this is unlikely. I feel that the quality of the name makes the first scenario probable.
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 04:27 PM
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 102
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
idncurious is a tad dodgy
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clotho View Post
中国.com was probably registered by one of the groups that tried to cheat the testbed pre-registration period. Instead of pre-registering with an approved registrar they registered the RACE version of the domain (bq-- etc.) directly prior to Nov. 10/2000. This effectively blocked the domain so nobody else could register it but it placed it outside of the testbed so when the RACE encoded names were migrated to Punycode (bq-- to xn--) they were not included.

Meanwhile somebody registered the Traditional version properly and became the variant owner when the migration actually took place.

I absolutely agree. This scenerio you suggested makes perfect sense. It would explain all my questions.

Clearly I can't see someone dropping this domain intentionally or unintentionally or accidently forgot to renew it.

It must have been taken away from him. And your scenerio of him registering the RACE code instead of going thru the proper testbed channel is mostly likely the reason.

Like Rubber Duck, hold on to the traditionals idns. Never know what pleasant surprise will come.:D
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 04:37 PM
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 102
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
idncurious is a tad dodgy
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clotho View Post
Meanwhile somebody registered the Traditional version properly and became the variant owner when the migration actually took place.

I just thought of something.

We all assume that when a idn is dropped then the variant owner (if exist) will eventually get that domain.

However, what if there is more than one variant owner.

Take the Chinese language for example..

We all know a single Chinese character can have more than 2 variants. Not to mention a single domain name is composed of more than one Chinese character. For example, a single Chinese domain name cam have 5 variants and potentially 5 different owners.

In this case, it would be most likely that the dropped domain will forever be "variant blocked" other wise there will be 5 registrants suing Verisign for ownership.

Last edited by idncurious; 27th April 2010 at 05:12 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 06:48 PM
Semi-retired
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Blighty
Posts: 5,531
iTrader: (57)
Rep Power: 3439
alpha has disabled reputation
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

..and there are many examples today of where the traditional and simplified are registered, most of the time they are owned by different people, but I know I have some in both.

how did it happen? well, I guess the variant table wasn't always as accurate as it is now.

and another thing, not all registrars are adhering to standards, if you know how, you can still registrar variants at certain registrars - people who are in the know on the whole snap thing will know exactly what I am talking about - so in summary it's a mess.

and who knows how it will be sorted out, if ever.
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 27th April 2010, 08:56 PM
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 102
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
idncurious is a tad dodgy
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Quote:
Originally Posted by alpha View Post

and who knows how it will be sorted out, if ever.
Cnnic handles it this way...

When a registrant registers a domain name, it automatically detects all other variants of that domain and gives them all to that registrant for free. So in other words, if the domain has 3 variants (in addition to the original), then he gets 4 domains for the price of 1. If it has 2 then 3 for the price of 1.

However, even that is not going to solve the problem cause language is not a precise science. It is like art that is full of gray areas. It constantly evolves/changes with time/culture/economics/social/geography/etc.

One can argue that this character is a variant but another can argue it is not- and they can both be right.

By definition, numbers are "precise" and languages are "messy"

So bottomline, you can try your best to make it less "messy"... but you can never completely get rid of the "mess".

Last edited by idncurious; 27th April 2010 at 08:58 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 28th April 2010, 05:11 PM
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 7,495
iTrader: (65)
Rep Power: 2677
blastfromthepast will become famous soon enoughblastfromthepast will become famous soon enoughblastfromthepast will become famous soon enoughblastfromthepast will become famous soon enoughblastfromthepast will become famous soon enoughblastfromthepast will become famous soon enoughblastfromthepast will become famous soon enoughblastfromthepast will become famous soon enoughblastfromthepast will become famous soon enough
Re: what happened to 中国.com?

Quote:
Originally Posted by idncurious View Post
Clearly I can't see someone dropping this domain intentionally or unintentionally or accidently forgot to renew it.
I can see it. Country names have dropped before.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT. The time now is 10:45 PM.

Site Sponsors
Your ad here
buy t-shirt
מחיר הזהב

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0
Copyright idnforums.com 2005

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54