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Old 15th September 2011, 09:50 PM
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Greek IDN VIP WG work published

"And, especially in Greek, we have a very unique and special problem in these
last few years. The use of (greeklish), which is the Greek words typed
sometimes in Latin characters.
And they have the same sound, the same meaning. Some people use them in
portable devices like mobile phones and stuff like that. And they should be
treated very carefully not to have two domain names that mean the same, or
that actually are used in the same way.
"


"
Evangelos Melagrakis: Yes. To give you an example of what may come up, let's take the
example of the Orthodox (chants). In Greek we can use (orfovoxos) in the
(cafaluso) or (fodox) in Demotic Key.
And this represents exactly the same thing. It's just the way we used to write it
in the (cafaluso), or we used to - or the way we write it in the Demotic Key.
You can't understand that we will have lot of words written in (cafaluso) and
Demotic Key. And this will represent a real variant problem I think. That's
why I tried to avoid the (cafaluso)"


Recording: https://community.icann.org/download...+Recording.mp3

Transcript: https://community.icann.org/download...Transcript.pdf

_________________________________

"Evangelos:
First comment: The example of accepting the variant is not correct in my opinion. It is wrong to
say that because we have some mobile phones that may not include a tonos or accent we should
prepare rules for those who enter a word incorrectly. Anything that is not a correct form should
not be registered. "

https://community.icann.org/download...rief+Notes.pdf

_________________________________


3.4 Scripts with Identical Characters
Evangelos: There are many possible issues that may come up, particular with Latin and
Cyrillic. It also may come up with IDNs of similar optical appearance so we may want to
suggest rules for registration.
3.5 Other Questions
Evangelos:
• In the case of the Greek script we don’t have different languages using the Greek
script but we have dialects that give us homophones.
• This gives us the opportunity to proceed on a script basis.
Panagiotis:
• With respect to the similarity with Cyrillic and Latin and confusability, i.e.
looking the same but not encoded the same way: ICANN should take advantage
of the progress that has already been made with respect to the similarity of the
scripts.
Evangelos:
• In Unicode the Greek Script comprises two tables.
• As we are working on the variant character issue I can see that there may be
issues with other scripts that are using Greek script for other purposes – for
example mathematical symbols. All of these characters have different Unicode
codes; we can identify them by their values. There is a clear distinction by their
code position.
• Concerning confusion: It exists but it is not the main problem. It is variants used
for the same purpose.
Panagiotis: While we may consider only TLDs and not mixed TLDs, our experiences
can be used for cases at other levels and ccTLDs.
Dennis:
• The primary concern is at the top level, but we are asking the questions for the
second level as well – they are tied together through the user experience.
• It helps us to explore what the issues are so this is deliberately vague.
Evangelos: This will help us to come up with some consistent rules.
Dennis:
• I think the user’s experience should be consistent, that is, what if the rules are
inconsistent?
• You could decide to limit yourselves to the top level but you might be missing an
opportunity.7
Panagiotis: The last question in section 3.5 is: “What should be the difference in
consideration of IDN ccTLDs and IDN gTLDs, if any?” What are we seeking with this
question?
Dennis: ccTLDs may have a narrower of character sets than gTLDs; there may be a
difference and if you think there is then we are asking you to consider it.
Panagiotis: There are three logical registries that may want to give Greek names: .gr, .cy,
and .eu and they may have different procedures.
Dennis:
• In a bundled set of variant strings in a script, you could imagine where one of
those strings is a trademark in one language, but isn’t in another. So what are the
objection procedures either at the top level or secondary level?
• This is more likely to happen in a gTLD world more than in a ccTLD world.
Reduction in complexity is a key way to move forward

https://community.icann.org/download...panagiotis.pdf
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Old 16th September 2011, 04:23 AM
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Re: Greek IDN VIP WG work published

Cyrillic is a variant of Greek. Roman is also a variant of Greek.

Last edited by blastfromthepast; 16th September 2011 at 04:24 AM..
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Old 16th September 2011, 10:26 AM
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Re: Greek IDN VIP WG work published

Quote:
Originally Posted by blastfromthepast View Post
Cyrillic is a variant of Greek. Roman is also a variant of Greek.
And who created the Greek alphabet?

"Clotho, along with her sisters and Hermes, was given credit for creating the alphabet for their people" :D
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Old 16th September 2011, 11:02 AM
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Re: Greek IDN VIP WG work published

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clotho View Post
So its you I can blame for the fact that with my Greek IDNs, I need to register two versions ( accented and unaccented ) !!
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Old 16th September 2011, 11:23 AM
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Re: Greek IDN VIP WG work published

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexd View Post
So its you I can blame for the fact that with my Greek IDNs, I need to register two versions ( accented and unaccented ) !!
As I recall, That idea was first of Lachesis but it was Hermes who really got hold and ran with it. :p

Lachesis liked to give people some choice but Hermes was the mischievous one. You can blame Atropos for Iota subscripts. She has always been inflexible and inevitable. She wanted to remind people that she came at the end.

Last edited by Clotho; 16th September 2011 at 11:35 AM.. Reason: clarity...
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Old 16th September 2011, 08:06 PM
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Re: Greek IDN VIP WG work published

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clotho View Post
Well done.

Last edited by blastfromthepast; 16th September 2011 at 08:08 PM..
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Old 16th September 2011, 08:08 PM
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Re: Greek IDN VIP WG work published

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexd View Post
So its you I can blame for the fact that with my Greek IDNs, I need to register two versions ( accented and unaccented ) !!
You're lucky one version doesn't block you from registering the other, as it does in some other notable cases.
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Old 18th September 2011, 10:58 AM
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Re: Greek IDN VIP WG work published

Quote:
Originally Posted by blastfromthepast View Post
Well done.
Thank you for playing along. :-)

The truth be told; if any one thing or group is going to take credit for the creation of the Greek alphabet and therefore via its subsequent evolution, our own Latin character set, it is the Phoenicians.



Even modern Cyrillic comes from Greek roots:



I have always been fascinated by the history of language. If you want to see more including the evolution of Arabic go to:

The Evolution of Alphabets

Last edited by Clotho; 18th September 2011 at 11:00 AM..
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