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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 19th October 2011, 06:31 AM
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Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin was due Wednesday to push for closer ex-Soviet integration after the surprise announcement of a free trade zone being created in the former communist bloc.


http://ca.news.yahoo.com/russias-put...061119008.html



:D

National language my a**, money is money

Last edited by DktoInc; 19th October 2011 at 06:38 AM..
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Old 19th October 2011, 02:24 PM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

Quote:
Originally Posted by DktoInc View Post
National language my a**, money is money
Which nation, which language? Georgia, Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania are not members of the CIS, and so will not be part of the proposed free-trade zone. Azerbaijan is holding back (probably doesn't want free trade with Armenia).

Kazakhstan has agreed to join, and has also supported Putin's proposal for a Eurasian Union (the Eurasian Union is intended to be like the European Union, except that EAU won't object to member states being ruled by presidents for life, and there will be only one dominant country, so no squabbling over who is boss).

So if you are referring to the concept of Kazakh as the "national language", you may be right.

A question for the forum: Does anyone know the linguistic situation in Azerbaijan? Was the transition from Azeri in Cyrillic to Azeri in Latin successful? What percentage of the population is fluent in Azeri? Which language, Azeri or Russian, is most often used in business?

Avtal
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Old 19th October 2011, 02:44 PM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

From 2009: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/13/we...ew/13levy.html

Note the graphic below the book photo towards the top.
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Old 19th October 2011, 06:49 PM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

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Originally Posted by Avtal View Post
Which nation, which language? Georgia, Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania are not members of the CIS, and so will not be part of the proposed free-trade zone. Azerbaijan is holding back (probably doesn't want free trade with Armenia).
no they are a part of the Schengen zone, but that is not really working for them either. Just give them some more time, they will croll back and start speaking russian again very soon like it's 1969.

http://video.i.ua/user/1034940/10330/318080/

Last edited by DktoInc; 19th October 2011 at 06:56 PM..
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Old 19th October 2011, 11:48 PM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

Quote:
Originally Posted by 555 View Post
From 2009: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/13/we...ew/13levy.html

Note the graphic below the book photo towards the top.

Quote:

Russian seems to be faring more poorly than other colonial languages because the countries that had to absorb it have a more cohesive sense of national identity and are now rallying around their native languages to assert their sovereignty.
temporary glitch.
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Old 20th October 2011, 02:47 AM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

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Originally Posted by DktoInc View Post
no they are a part of the Schengen zone, but that is not really working for them either. Just give them some more time, they will croll back and start speaking russian again very soon like it's 1969.

http://video.i.ua/user/1034940/10330/318080/
Hmm. From Wikipedia:
Quote:
With a population of 1.34 million, Estonia is one of the least-populous members of the European Union, Eurozone and NATO. Today, Estonia has the highest GDP per person among former Soviet republics.[9] Estonia is listed as a "High-Income Economy" by the World Bank, as an "advanced economy" by the International Monetary Fund and the country is an OECD member. The United Nations lists Estonia as a developed country with a Human Development Index of "Very High".[5] The country is also ranked highly for press freedom, economic freedom, democracy and political freedom and education.
So you are predicting that the Estonians will tire of all this, and will crawl back to Mother Russia like a repentant teenager returning to its abusive, alcoholic parent.

And I predict they won't.

Let's return to this thread in 5 years, and see who is right.

Avtal

P.S. My Russian isn't good enough to follow all of the video, unfortunately.
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Old 20th October 2011, 05:22 AM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avtal View Post
Hmm. From Wikipedia:

So you are predicting that the Estonians will tire of all this, and will crawl back to Mother Russia like a repentant teenager returning to its abusive, alcoholic parent.

And I predict they won't.

Let's return to this thread in 5 years, and see who is right.

Avtal

P.S. My Russian isn't good enough to follow all of the video, unfortunately.

why are focusing on just Estonia? it's not like they drink vodka differently. Lets do the whole former USSR

Last edited by DktoInc; 20th October 2011 at 05:24 AM..
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Old 20th October 2011, 02:37 PM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

Quote:
Originally Posted by DktoInc View Post
why are focusing on just Estonia? it's not like they drink vodka differently. Lets do the whole former USSR
Wrong. The Estonians, unlike the Russians, sip their vodka delicately, and only after they have mixed it with fizzy fruit juices.

Just kidding. I suspect that the Estonians drink vodka the way the Finns do, that is to say, copiously.

Avtal

Last edited by Avtal; 20th October 2011 at 02:57 PM..
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Old 20th October 2011, 10:51 PM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avtal View Post
Wrong. The Estonians, unlike the Russians, sip their vodka delicately, and only after they have mixed it with fizzy fruit juices.

Just kidding. I suspect that the Estonians drink vodka the way the Finns do, that is to say, copiously.

Avtal

I have a few Estonian friends, not sure about sipping delicately, they chug like Russians and let me tell you they don't care whether it was made in Finland, France or Russia, double distilled or triple, 40 degree's or 80 .
but then again some people are delicate and some are not. You can't really compare Finns to any former USSR Territory. They are just different culture.
Never heard Pushkin in Estonian, but it should be an interesting show after a few bottles, now that 555 brought up the article, just wondering how do they make it rime? I remember reading Pushkin in Russian, and the whole point to his poems is that they rime:

Я помню чудное мгновенье:
Передо мной явилась ты,
Как мимолетное виденье,
Как гений чистой красоты.


The point to his children's stories as far as I remember was that most of them were written in a style of poetry:

У лукоморья дуб зелёный;
Златая цепь на дубе том:
И днём и ночью кот учёный
Всё ходит по цепи кругом;


lol

this fullishnes of translating him into local languages should be secondary optional, and not a forced primary.

I don't predict, I call it how i c it. Tomorrow if I see change i will say it, but the way things are right now, I don't see a lot of options for most of the former soviet territories. I don't know what is going to happen 5 years from now but It will be interesting to see so lets take all of them come back in 5 years and see how many will join the free trade union with Russia. I think making Russian official in the constitution may be pushing it, but i see a huge chance of that taking place as well.

Georgia
Ukraine
Moldova
Belarus
Armenia
Azerbaijan
Kazakhstan
Uzbekistan
Turkmenistan
Kyrgyzstan
Tajikistan
Estonia
Latvia
Lithuania
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Old 21st October 2011, 07:15 AM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

If anybody knows Putin and wants to broker СССР.com let me know ... :p
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Old 22nd October 2011, 06:25 AM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

Some articles on the subject of the Russian language in Central Asia:

http://www.eurasianet.org/node/64348 (Many Central Asian guest workers in Russia can't speak Russian)
http://www.eurasianet.org/node/64236 (The use of Russian has declined in Central Asia, but may be starting to revive)
http://www.eurasianet.org/node/64170 (Debate in Kazakhstan over the role of Russian)

Avtal

P.S. At the recently opened Nazarbayev University in Astana (Kazakhstan), the language of instruction is English.
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Old 22nd October 2011, 10:24 PM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

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Originally Posted by Avtal View Post
P.S. At the recently opened Nazarbayev University in Astana (Kazakhstan), the language of instruction is English.

you mean this one?

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Old 22nd October 2011, 10:45 PM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

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Originally Posted by DktoInc View Post
you mean this one?

That's the one. From the photo it is hard to tell whether the Cyrillic above the door is Назарбаев Университеті (Kazakh) or Назарбаев Университет (Russian).

But this photo (of the same sign) clears up the mystery: http://www.panoramio.com/photo/39573089. The Cyrillic reads "Назарбаев Университеті" (in Kazakh, the national language).

Avtal

Last edited by Avtal; 22nd October 2011 at 10:45 PM..
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Old 23rd October 2011, 05:38 AM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avtal View Post
That's the one. From the photo it is hard to tell whether the Cyrillic above the door is Назарбаев Университеті (Kazakh) or Назарбаев Университет (Russian).

But this photo (of the same sign) clears up the mystery: http://www.panoramio.com/photo/39573089. The Cyrillic reads "Назарбаев Университеті" (in Kazakh, the national language).

Avtal



yeahhh, still have the instructions in Russian. http://rus.nu.edu.kz/
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Old 23rd October 2011, 05:55 AM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

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Originally Posted by DktoInc View Post
yeahhh, still have the instructions in Russian. http://rus.nu.edu.kz/
That's right, the web site is available in three languages: Kazakh, English, and Russian. Notice that the shortest domain (nu.edu.kz) takes you to the version in Kazakh, the national language. The site is also provided in English, for the professors, and in Russian, for those citizens of Kazakhstan who have not yet managed to learn the national language.

Avtal
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Old 23rd October 2011, 08:06 AM
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Re: Russia's Putin pushes for closer ex-Soviet union

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avtal View Post
That's right, the web site is available in three languages: Kazakh, English, and Russian. Notice that the shortest domain (nu.edu.kz) takes you to the version in Kazakh, the national language. The site is also provided in English, for the professors, and in Russian, for those citizens of Kazakhstan who have not yet managed to learn the national language.

Avtal
I get that they are trying to enforce native language more and more in all former territories. Still it's all about the willingness to learn a new language + financial situation in the country to improve the education system / on the other hand you have an already fully developed language that everyone mostly speaks, but the language is not under the official status and your government is not improving one or the other in the end people have to communicate somehow, officially or not officially, most of Central Asia is in that situation, but will come back to this in 5 years and see what has changed.


On a same but different topic:

inter-ethnic communication in a idncctld zone. Is it even possible or a new ISO has to be created?

Last edited by DktoInc; 23rd October 2011 at 08:08 AM..
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