IDN Forums - Internationalized Domain Names  
Home | Advertise on idnforums | Premium Membership

Go Back   IDN Forums - Internationalized Domain Names > IDN Discussions > New gTLDs

New gTLDs IDN or ascii, use this forum to discuss the new gTLDs

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21 (permalink)  
Old 14th June 2012, 08:53 PM
bumblebee man's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Germany
Posts: 1,620
iTrader: (16)
Rep Power: 2962
bumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura about
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by welkin View Post
If .com holders believe .点看 is the Chinese equivalent, that's what they will advertise. After hearing it in ads for long enough, it won't seem strange. "com" isn't a dictionary word either. Just my two mao.

Anyone remember when Internet addresses first started being advertised? It seemed like people learned ".com" overnight, despite it really not meaning anything.
There never was a dotcom advertising campaign by Verisign. All big brands used it because there was no alternative. Can't see that happening with 点看.

Quote:
Originally Posted by welkin View Post
I wonder when .点看 (and the others) will replace the .com key on the iPhone...
Never.
__________________
These are my principles. If you don't like them, I have others. - Groucho Marx
Reply With Quote
  #22 (permalink)  
Old 14th June 2012, 09:20 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 383
iTrader: (12)
Rep Power: 1201
welkin will become famous soon enoughwelkin will become famous soon enoughwelkin will become famous soon enoughwelkin will become famous soon enoughwelkin will become famous soon enoughwelkin will become famous soon enoughwelkin will become famous soon enough
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by bumblebee man View Post
There never was a dotcom advertising campaign by Verisign. All big brands used it because there was no alternative. Can't see that happening with 点看.
What do you think the better alternative to .点看 is for big brands?
Reply With Quote
  #23 (permalink)  
Old 14th June 2012, 09:45 PM
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,046
iTrader: (60)
Rep Power: 2396
bwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enough
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by welkin View Post
What do you think the better alternative to .点看 is for big brands?
The "best" choice for .com was thought to be: .公司

http://www.mdbg.net/chindict/chindic...5%AC%E5%8F%B8+

公司 gōng​sī​ *公司* | 公司* | *公司 (business) company / company / firm / corporation / incorporated / CL: 家 HSK 2


译词 yì​cí​ *译词* | 译词* | *译词 translated word (such as company 公司 or bus 巴士 or club 俱樂部|俱乐部)
Reply With Quote
  #24 (permalink)  
Old 14th June 2012, 09:52 PM
bumblebee man's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Germany
Posts: 1,620
iTrader: (16)
Rep Power: 2962
bumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura aboutbumblebee man has a spectacular aura about
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by welkin View Post
What do you think the better alternative to .点看 is for big brands?
Well, atm most seem to be happy with their ASCII names for whatever reason. If IDN.IDN made them re-think / re-brand there will be 67 Chinese IDN gTLDs to choose from, most of which are a lot more meaningful than 点看.

This could be different if there was some a strong connotation between 点看 and dotcom but it doesn't seem to be there.
__________________
These are my principles. If you don't like them, I have others. - Groucho Marx
Reply With Quote
  #25 (permalink)  
Old 14th June 2012, 09:54 PM
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,046
iTrader: (60)
Rep Power: 2396
bwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enough
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

THE RED FLAG WAS UP IN 2011, EVEN DREWBERT TRIED TO GIVE THEM A KICK IN THE SHINS!

From February of 2011:

http://domainincite.com/3505-verisig...he-chinese-com


Pat Kane (OF VERISIGN) says:
February 17, 2011 at 7:41 pm
Kevin,

Just as a point of clarification, based on the details you described in your story, it is unlikely that Verisign would view the Chinese-language versions of the full words “company” and “network” reported to be sought by the Chinese government to be the same as – or even “confusingly similar” to – the transliterated versions of.com and .net that Verisign would potentially seek.

Verisign does not operate “.company” in ASCII text, and it is not likely that we’d seek it in other scripts. Our primary interest would be in a Chinese transliteration of the three-letter extension “.com,” not the word company.

While domains based on Chinese-language versions of the words ”company” and “network” may serve similar audiences as .com and .net, Verisign views them both as viable choices for Internet identities , as long as it doesn’t create unnecessary confusion surrounding .com and .net. Internet end-users around the globe already have many domain choices that serve similar audiences (.co.uk, .co, .biz, etc.) and we look forward to continuing to provide meaningful identity services beyond when new gTLDs are introduced.

Our IDN strategy is focused on ensuring that all users enjoy a predictable, uniform experience in .com and .net regardless of their language or geographic location. When we apply for IDN versions of .com and .net, we will be applying for direct transliterations of “.com” and “.net,” which we believe will help to ensure continuity and connectivity. Of course, there may be instances where the transliteration itself – when translated – means something inappropriate, in which case we would seek an alternative.

Another aspect of Verisign’s IDN strategy may, at some point, involve acting as the registry operator or provide back-end registry services for other IDN tlds, but that would be unlikely to have an impact on the dynamic you describe.

Pat

Reply
Drewbert says:
February 18, 2011 at 3:06 am
Pat,

Did you bother to check to see what the “transliteration” of .com and .net were (hint: there aren’t any) before publicly handing over your intellectual property to someone else.

Why do you think CNNIC uses 公司.cn (company) for it’s IDN version of com.cn ?

If you can’t get your mind around the Chinese language, employ someone at Verisign who can BEFORE you go making such statements in public and flushing your best asset down the toilet.

THERE GOES VERISIGN’S STOCK PRICE.
Reply With Quote
  #26 (permalink)  
Old 14th June 2012, 10:05 PM
TrafficDomainer's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,070
iTrader: (10)
Rep Power: 906
TrafficDomainer is on a distinguished roadTrafficDomainer is on a distinguished roadTrafficDomainer is on a distinguished roadTrafficDomainer is on a distinguished roadTrafficDomainer is on a distinguished roadTrafficDomainer is on a distinguished road
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by bwhhisc View Post
THE RED FLAG WAS UP IN 2011, EVEN DREWBERT TRIED TO GIVE THEM A KICK IN THE SHINS!

From February of 2011:

http://domainincite.com/3505-verisig...he-chinese-com


Pat Kane (OF VERISIGN) says:
February 17, 2011 at 7:41 pm
Kevin,

Just as a point of clarification, based on the details you described in your story, it is unlikely that Verisign would view the Chinese-language versions of the full words “company” and “network” reported to be sought by the Chinese government to be the same as – or even “confusingly similar” to – the transliterated versions of.com and .net that Verisign would potentially seek.

Verisign does not operate “.company” in ASCII text, and it is not likely that we’d seek it in other scripts. Our primary interest would be in a Chinese transliteration of the three-letter extension “.com,” not the word company.

While domains based on Chinese-language versions of the words ”company” and “network” may serve similar audiences as .com and .net, Verisign views them both as viable choices for Internet identities , as long as it doesn’t create unnecessary confusion surrounding .com and .net. Internet end-users around the globe already have many domain choices that serve similar audiences (.co.uk, .co, .biz, etc.) and we look forward to continuing to provide meaningful identity services beyond when new gTLDs are introduced.

Our IDN strategy is focused on ensuring that all users enjoy a predictable, uniform experience in .com and .net regardless of their language or geographic location. When we apply for IDN versions of .com and .net, we will be applying for direct transliterations of “.com” and “.net,” which we believe will help to ensure continuity and connectivity. Of course, there may be instances where the transliteration itself – when translated – means something inappropriate, in which case we would seek an alternative.

Another aspect of Verisign’s IDN strategy may, at some point, involve acting as the registry operator or provide back-end registry services for other IDN tlds, but that would be unlikely to have an impact on the dynamic you describe.

Pat

Reply
Drewbert says:
February 18, 2011 at 3:06 am
Pat,

Did you bother to check to see what the “transliteration” of .com and .net were (hint: there aren’t any) before publicly handing over your intellectual property to someone else.

Why do you think CNNIC uses 公司.cn (company) for it’s IDN version of com.cn ?

If you can’t get your mind around the Chinese language, employ someone at Verisign who can BEFORE you go making such statements in public and flushing your best asset down the toilet.

THERE GOES VERISIGN’S STOCK PRICE.
I posted this in the other thread, but it is probably more relevant here:

" .....from the domaincite link, Drew tried his best to point out to Pat that even CNNIC uses 公司.cn (company) for it’s IDN version of com.cn. Pat's silence in not responding to Drew's statements speaks volume. If a Chinese entity views 公司 as a .com best equivalence through the use of 公司.cn mapping to .com.cn and Pat does not, something is not right there. Smells like some back door deal to hand over what should have been Verisign's IP and effectively their registrants who hold corresponding idn.coms in Chinese. Effectively, IDN.com registrants in Chinese are being robbed of their rights to .gongsi domains. Agree with Drew, Pat is not acting in the best interest of Verisign shareholders nor their customer (the registrants)."

Also agree with Squirrel in the other thread:

"not only that but there is no such thing as transliterations in Chinese, which makes the statement even more odd."

Last edited by TrafficDomainer; 14th June 2012 at 10:11 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #27 (permalink)  
Old 14th June 2012, 10:20 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,229
iTrader: (29)
Rep Power: 1135
chrisofmel is on a distinguished roadchrisofmel is on a distinguished roadchrisofmel is on a distinguished roadchrisofmel is on a distinguished roadchrisofmel is on a distinguished roadchrisofmel is on a distinguished road
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by bwhhisc View Post
Regarding .com, that's there to stay.

If its going to be on an Apple device, 'that' button may someday be replaced by one (from Apple) that says "SIRI"

http://www.apple.com/iphone/features/siri.html

What is shaping up is a showdown of technology by Apple vs. Google......with wildcards Yahoo and Microsoft.
yep Apple see's Google as it's biggest threat, Google see's facebook as it's biggest threat, that's why the Apple/Facebook deal announced this week and also Apple maps announcement. the big thing i see is Apple seems to like direct navigation anything they can do to quit lining Google's pockets by sending them traffic. so they like the .com button and automatic .com amendment or auto-complete. this is just my opinion
Reply With Quote
  #28 (permalink)  
Old 14th June 2012, 10:46 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 383
iTrader: (12)
Rep Power: 1201
welkin will become famous soon enoughwelkin will become famous soon enoughwelkin will become famous soon enoughwelkin will become famous soon enoughwelkin will become famous soon enoughwelkin will become famous soon enoughwelkin will become famous soon enough
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by bwhhisc View Post
The "best" choice for .com was thought to be: .公司

http://www.mdbg.net/chindict/chindic...5%AC%E5%8F%B8+

公司 gōng​sī​ *公司* | 公司* | *公司 (business) company / company / firm / corporation / incorporated / CL: 家 HSK 2


译词 yì​cí​ *译词* | 译词* | *译词 translated word (such as company 公司 or bus 巴士 or club 俱樂部|俱乐部)
It seems there some factors still:

1) a number of big brands might not be as comfortable with CNNIC as with Verisign
2) .点看 sounds similar to .com; and even if .公司 is the inherently superior extension, by not being the official .com IDN now, isn't it just relegated to the .whatever category (presumably none of which will challenge .com)
3) existing .com holders might just use .点看 because they will already have rights to it

Eh, maybe trying too hard to be optimistic. But I think it's too early to say .点看 is done for (is that the sentiment here? could make a good poll).
Reply With Quote
  #29 (permalink)  
Old 14th June 2012, 11:00 PM
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,046
iTrader: (60)
Rep Power: 2396
bwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enough
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by welkin View Post
1) a number of big brands might not be as comfortable with CNNIC as with Verisign
Now that's the understatement of the year. It's the wild, wild west with business in China. Read James Seng blog today,
i think a link is in this thread but he has his own analogy. The only rules are there are no rules except what the 'party'
decides that week and that very well could change the next. Or at least that is their track record well beyond the .cn BS.

Last edited by bwhhisc; 14th June 2012 at 11:06 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #30 (permalink)  
Old 14th June 2012, 11:29 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 791
iTrader: (13)
Rep Power: 992
domainsell is on a distinguished roaddomainsell is on a distinguished roaddomainsell is on a distinguished roaddomainsell is on a distinguished roaddomainsell is on a distinguished roaddomainsell is on a distinguished road
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

"If a Chinese entity views 公司 as a .com best equivalence through the use of 公司.cn mapping to .com.cn and Pat does not, something is not right there."

Can anything be done? It would be nice if Mr. Kane could respond.

I think as mentioned as long as the .com owner gets to activate the .点看 it is still a pure idn.idn.
I think the decision to use something other than what .cn uses for company looks very fishy.
Reply With Quote
  #31 (permalink)  
Old 15th June 2012, 03:29 AM
Drewbert's Avatar
Administrator
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 6,095
iTrader: (20)
Rep Power: 0
Drewbert is a tad dodgyDrewbert is a tad dodgyDrewbert is a tad dodgyDrewbert is a tad dodgyDrewbert is a tad dodgyDrewbert is a tad dodgyDrewbert is a tad dodgy
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay View Post
Well how about this one: 性感女人.点看 - 'sexy women. click and see.' I reckon you'd be on a winner there.
Might be bad for SEO though. IIRC Google doesn't like links that have "invitations to click" in them
__________________
It's all jaded style to me.
Reply With Quote
  #32 (permalink)  
Old 15th June 2012, 01:12 PM
Jay's Avatar
Jay Jay is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Where angels fear to tread
Posts: 1,305
iTrader: (23)
Rep Power: 1783
Jay will become famous soon enoughJay will become famous soon enoughJay will become famous soon enoughJay will become famous soon enoughJay will become famous soon enoughJay will become famous soon enoughJay will become famous soon enoughJay will become famous soon enough
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drewbert View Post
Might be bad for SEO though. IIRC Google doesn't like links that have "invitations to click" in them
That's okay, no one uses Google in China anyway.
Reply With Quote
  #33 (permalink)  
Old 18th June 2012, 07:36 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,806
iTrader: (19)
Rep Power: 771
Giant is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Hi Friends, long time no see!

First, congratulations to all! IDN.IDN is finally here to stay, and we all have made a smart decision in investing in IDN.

Also, thanks for mentioning Giant :-).

I want to tell you guys I appreciate very much your brilliant analysis and judgment. For the most part I agree with you that .点看 is a bad choice, but I also see the prospect that .点看 can be a good or even very good extention if we have a good strategy to go with it. So, don't worry but be happy, for the long wait is finally over.

Following conventional translation methods or traditional Chinese naming strategy, .点看 is considered a very bad translit because the word is meaningless. No any serious businessman having a sound mind would choose such a meaningless name for their business. But we are now in a new age -- internet age, a new way of thinking and a new strategy may be required to win the competition. 点看 is just a replecement for the popular DotCom and not a new extention by itself and is therefore not hard to market. I already come up with a strategy to help make IDN.com the most loved domain name for Chinese netizens by employing the word 点看, but I won't disclose it for now because I still treat it as trade secret. I don't know what strategy VeriSign had in mind when they picked .点看 for the giant Chinese market, the fact that they had the gut to choose such a bad extention convinces me that they must have a strategy.

Of course, if we have the option to choose, I still prefer .公司 over .点看. But since China already revealed their intention, it is not a good idea to fight with the bully.

After all, IDN.com will soon be king in China, not IDN.IDN.
__________________
@

Dot Com is King. IDN.com will soon be king.
@

Last edited by Giant; 18th June 2012 at 07:37 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #34 (permalink)  
Old 18th June 2012, 07:40 PM
555 555 is offline
ком.ком コム.コム
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,141
iTrader: (33)
Rep Power: 1768
555 has disabled reputation
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

If i remember correctly there was a specific language where it is not required to use switch+alt to then type the .com or another extension part? Anyone remembers what language that was?
__________________
ロレックス.com رولكس.com Ролекс.com Порше.com 路易威登.com 必胜宅急送.com 香港迪士尼乐园.com Hermès.com Nestlé.com
Reply With Quote
  #35 (permalink)  
Old 18th June 2012, 07:43 PM
Semi-retired
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Blighty
Posts: 5,534
iTrader: (57)
Rep Power: 3528
alpha has disabled reputation
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by 555 View Post
If i remember correctly there was a specific language where it is not required to use switch+alt to then type the .com or another extension part? Anyone remembers what language that was?
.jp for sure I know off. Or were you thinking of a gTLD + specific language ?
Reply With Quote
  #36 (permalink)  
Old 18th June 2012, 07:46 PM
555 555 is offline
ком.ком コム.コム
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,141
iTrader: (33)
Rep Power: 1768
555 has disabled reputation
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by alpha View Post
.jp for sure I know off. Or were you thinking of a gTLD + specific language ?
Yeah i think that's it, thanks.
__________________
ロレックス.com رولكس.com Ролекс.com Порше.com 路易威登.com 必胜宅急送.com 香港迪士尼乐园.com Hermès.com Nestlé.com
Reply With Quote
  #37 (permalink)  
Old 18th June 2012, 07:47 PM
Semi-retired
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Blighty
Posts: 5,534
iTrader: (57)
Rep Power: 3528
alpha has disabled reputation
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giant View Post
Hi Friends, long time no see!
hey there Joe, good to see you again

Last edited by alpha; 18th June 2012 at 07:47 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #38 (permalink)  
Old 18th June 2012, 07:50 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,806
iTrader: (19)
Rep Power: 771
Giant is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by alpha View Post
hey there Joe, good to see you again
Thanks. Haha...
__________________
@

Dot Com is King. IDN.com will soon be king.
@
Reply With Quote
  #39 (permalink)  
Old 18th June 2012, 07:57 PM
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,046
iTrader: (60)
Rep Power: 2396
bwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enoughbwhhisc will become famous soon enough
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giant View Post
.点看 is considered a very bad translit because the word is meaningless. No any serious businessman having a sound mind would choose such a meaningless name for their business.
Welcome back Joe....don't mince words, tell us what you really think!

Reply With Quote
  #40 (permalink)  
Old 18th June 2012, 08:47 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,806
iTrader: (19)
Rep Power: 771
Giant is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: 點看= com? What was Verisign thinking-

Quote:
Originally Posted by bwhhisc View Post
Welcome back Joe....don't mince words, tell us what you really think!

Thanks. OK, here's what I really think: Cheers!
__________________
@

Dot Com is King. IDN.com will soon be king.
@
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT. The time now is 02:50 AM.

Site Sponsors
Your ad here
buy t-shirt
מחיר הזהב

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0
Copyright idnforums.com 2005

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58