IDN Forums - Internationalized Domain Names  
Home | Advertise on idnforums | Premium Membership

Go Back   IDN Forums - Internationalized Domain Names > IDN Discussions > General Discussion

General Discussion Feel free to talk about anything and everything in this board.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 17th July 2012, 06:59 PM
DktoInc's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Land of the Loon
Posts: 1,583
iTrader: (2)
Rep Power: 2168
DktoInc has a spectacular aura aboutDktoInc has a spectacular aura aboutDktoInc has a spectacular aura aboutDktoInc has a spectacular aura aboutDktoInc has a spectacular aura aboutDktoInc has a spectacular aura aboutDktoInc has a spectacular aura aboutDktoInc has a spectacular aura aboutDktoInc has a spectacular aura about
Internet Adds More Domain Names

http://www.zacks.com/stock/news/7882...e-domain-names

VeriSign recently applied for nine Internationalized Domain Name (IDN) transliterations of .com and three IDN transliterations of .net.

The applications submitted by VeriSign represent approximately 12 out of the 14 new generic Top Level Domain (gTLD) applications. The company submitted the applications through the Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers' (ICANN) new gTLD program.

IDN aims to make the Internet more user-friendly to end users all over the world by enabling them to identify themselves using their native language scripts. VeriSign has applied for IDN transliterations of .com in nine non-Latin based scripts.

Management expects these non-Latin based transliterations of .com and .net to open more options for global Internet users.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 23rd July 2012, 05:18 PM
g's Avatar
g g is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 986
iTrader: (10)
Rep Power: 841
g is on a distinguished roadg is on a distinguished roadg is on a distinguished roadg is on a distinguished roadg is on a distinguished roadg is on a distinguished road
Re: Internet Adds More Domain Names

thanks for the article ))))

This is the normal expected evolution pathway

..... IDN transliterations of .com and .net

any other .IDN extension in any other language will be a failure

and whatever the language natives say about transliterations for whatever reason ..... sooner or later they gonna like it

those verisign guys know exactly what they are doing .... they carefully choose transliterations .... and I think they will earn a lot of money at the end !
__________________
two traffic and revenue persian IDNs for sale , click here

Last edited by g; 23rd July 2012 at 05:19 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 23rd July 2012, 05:33 PM
IdnHost's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: canada
Posts: 806
iTrader: (11)
Rep Power: 536
IdnHost is on a distinguished roadIdnHost is on a distinguished roadIdnHost is on a distinguished roadIdnHost is on a distinguished roadIdnHost is on a distinguished roadIdnHost is on a distinguished road
Thumbs up Re: Internet Adds More Domain Names

Quote:
Originally Posted by g View Post
thanks for the article ))))

This is the normal expected evolution pathway

..... IDN transliterations of .com and .net

any other .IDN extension in any other language will be a failure.
With all due respect, its a little bit early to make such assumptions dont you think?
after all this is just the first phase of idns, the next step may very well be whatever was missed this round. ie arabic.net etc.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 23rd July 2012, 08:32 PM
Rubber Duck's Avatar
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Czech Republic (For those of you from USA = Chechnya)
Posts: 15,929
iTrader: (59)
Rep Power: 4507
Rubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura about
Re: Internet Adds More Domain Names

Quote:
Originally Posted by IdnHost View Post
With all due respect, its a little bit early to make such assumptions dont you think?
after all this is just the first phase of idns, the next step may very well be whatever was missed this round. ie arabic.net etc.
Sorry but Arabic IDN.com are racing away. These may well be largely superceded by transliterations, but it is already pretty much game over.

As for transliteration of dot net into Arabic characters. Verisign own these whether they cash in the option or not.

Stats for our Arabic character domain portfolio for this Friday:

2012-07-20 Fri. 3,970 242 6.10% $ 0.46 $ 27.87 $ 110.65
__________________
All offers to sell are void.

Last edited by Rubber Duck; 23rd July 2012 at 08:38 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 23rd July 2012, 09:47 PM
IdnHost's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: canada
Posts: 806
iTrader: (11)
Rep Power: 536
IdnHost is on a distinguished roadIdnHost is on a distinguished roadIdnHost is on a distinguished roadIdnHost is on a distinguished roadIdnHost is on a distinguished roadIdnHost is on a distinguished road
Re: Internet Adds More Domain Names

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubber Duck View Post
Sorry but Arabic IDN.com are racing away. These may well be largely superceded by transliterations, but it is already pretty much game over.

As for transliteration of dot net into Arabic characters. Verisign own these whether they cash in the option or not.

Stats for our Arabic character domain portfolio for this Friday:

2012-07-20 Fri. 3,970 242 6.10% $ 0.46 $ 27.87 $ 110.65
arabic.net was just an example, there are a few others. but thats not the point. im not suggesting that the .net is going to overtake the .com in any language. what im saying is that i dont see other extentions being a failure in the future simply because they were not applied for this round. i believe it is too early in the game to assume that just because verisign did not apply for a certain extension in the top scripts that they will not do so in the near future. Why should it end here?

By the way, nice stats

Last edited by IdnHost; 23rd July 2012 at 09:49 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 23rd July 2012, 09:52 PM
Rubber Duck's Avatar
Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Czech Republic (For those of you from USA = Chechnya)
Posts: 15,929
iTrader: (59)
Rep Power: 4507
Rubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura aboutRubber Duck has a spectacular aura about
Re: Internet Adds More Domain Names

Quote:
Originally Posted by IdnHost View Post
arabic.net was just an example, there are a few others. but thats not the point. im not suggesting that the .net is going to overtake the .com in any language. what im saying is that i dont see other extentions being a failure in the future simply because they were not applied for this round. i believe it is too early in the game to assume that just because verisign did not apply for a certain extension in the top scripts that they will not do so in the near future. Why should it end here?

By the way, nice stats
Of course it is not the end, rather it will be interminable. We are talking ICANN here. But at least for the extensions that Verisign has applied for the end can reasonably be envisaged.
__________________
All offers to sell are void.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 24th July 2012, 07:29 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: alburrica
Posts: 230
iTrader: (14)
Rep Power: 464
camarro is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: Internet Adds More Domain Names

Quote:
Originally Posted by g View Post
those verisign guys know exactly what they are doing .... they carefully choose transliterations .... and I think they will earn a lot of money at the end !
I appreciate your optimism, and honestly hope you are right.
Personally i think verisign's behaviour in this whole process leaves much to be desired and reveals not only lack of vision but plain disbelief in their product. I think it's the end of a myth for some here.
Starting with the number of transliterations applied, passing to some of the transliterations itself, criteria for choice within that limited number, etc.
I think it's clear now that the responsability for the whole IDN.IDN tld process not beeing resolved sooner but instead beein bundled with all the other .crap extensions can not be fully attributed to ICANN. In the light of what we know today i think it's highly doubtful that verisign has done any kind of pressure for an earlier process.
The whole application smells of disbelief, they should have applied for dozens of transliterations....impact on their budget would have been close to nothing and they would have sent a clear message to all web users.
Instead they didn't even covered the basics, more than cautious they seem skeptical of their own product, this is specially notable in the lack of more .nets translits applications. I don't know if they entered some kind of agreement with ICANN regarding direct competition with cctld's or if they just simple dont believe there's room for .net between cctld's and the new .com translits, either way they just seem to want to wait and see.
3 .nets applications only. Two of them (Korean and chinese) pretty obvious considering high current registrations numbers, only in hindi they seem willing to risk a bit....but not much...just taking advantage of the lack of any cctld to grab all the market share they can while they still can (forgetting all the other indian languages in the process by the way)
Not enough..not even close.
...
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 24th July 2012, 07:49 PM
squirrel's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,940
iTrader: (11)
Rep Power: 7080
squirrel is a name known to all
squirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to allsquirrel is a name known to all
Re: Internet Adds More Domain Names

Quote:
Originally Posted by camarro View Post
I appreciate your optimism, and honestly hope you are right.
Personally i think verisign's behaviour in this whole process leaves much to be desired and reveals not only lack of vision but plain disbelief in their product. I think it's the end of a myth for some here.
Starting with the number of transliterations applied, passing to some of the transliterations itself, criteria for choice within that limited number, etc.
I think it's clear now that the responsability for the whole IDN.IDN tld process not beeing resolved sooner but instead beein bundled with all the other .crap extensions can not be fully attributed to ICANN. In the light of what we know today i think it's highly doubtful that verisign has done any kind of pressure for an earlier process.
The whole application smells of disbelief, they should have applied for dozens of transliterations....impact on their budget would have been close to nothing and they would have sent a clear message to all web users.
Instead they didn't even covered the basics, more than cautious they seem skeptical of their own product, this is specially notable in the lack of more .nets translits applications. I don't know if they entered some kind of agreement with ICANN regarding direct competition with cctld's or if they just simple dont believe there's room for .net between cctld's and the new .com translits, either way they just seem to want to wait and see.
3 .nets applications only. Two of them (Korean and chinese) pretty obvious considering high current registrations numbers, only in hindi they seem willing to risk a bit....but not much...just taking advantage of the lack of any cctld to grab all the market share they can while they still can (forgetting all the other indian languages in the process by the way)
Not enough..not even close.
...
I'm surprised by your post. You seemed reasonably sure in the past that indic languages would not be applied for by Verisign in the 1st round, except perhaps Hindi -and Tamil-. So the current situation can't be much of a let down for you, can it ?

Also I'm always a bit surprised when people critize Verisign for its dealing with ICANN. I personally did my best to engage with ICANN and its various instances on many occasions and it's very difficult to get something going. It sure looks like Verisign isn't doing much with respect to IDNs but it doesn't mean they haven't tried. Same goes for PIR by the way.. anyhow, it's very difficult for me to think that guys like Chuck Gomes and Ram Mohan aren't fully invested in making IDNs a commercial success.

PS: The single char TLDs issue is the reason VRSN hasn't been pushing for IDN gTLD fastrack in my opinion.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 24th July 2012, 09:46 PM
idn's Avatar
idn idn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Global Headquarters of the Dot Net Skepticism Alliance
Posts: 3,156
iTrader: (38)
Rep Power: 1240
idn is on a distinguished roadidn is on a distinguished roadidn is on a distinguished roadidn is on a distinguished roadidn is on a distinguished roadidn is on a distinguished road
Re: Internet Adds More Domain Names

Quote:
Originally Posted by camarro View Post
I appreciate your optimism, and honestly hope you are right.
Personally i think verisign's behaviour in this whole process leaves much to be desired and reveals not only lack of vision but plain disbelief in their product. I think it's the end of a myth for some here.
Starting with the number of transliterations applied, passing to some of the transliterations itself, criteria for choice within that limited number, etc.
I think it's clear now that the responsability for the whole IDN.IDN tld process not beeing resolved sooner but instead beein bundled with all the other .crap extensions can not be fully attributed to ICANN. In the light of what we know today i think it's highly doubtful that verisign has done any kind of pressure for an earlier process.
The whole application smells of disbelief, they should have applied for dozens of transliterations....impact on their budget would have been close to nothing and they would have sent a clear message to all web users.
Instead they didn't even covered the basics, more than cautious they seem skeptical of their own product, this is specially notable in the lack of more .nets translits applications. I don't know if they entered some kind of agreement with ICANN regarding direct competition with cctld's or if they just simple dont believe there's room for .net between cctld's and the new .com translits, either way they just seem to want to wait and see.
3 .nets applications only. Two of them (Korean and chinese) pretty obvious considering high current registrations numbers, only in hindi they seem willing to risk a bit....but not much...just taking advantage of the lack of any cctld to grab all the market share they can while they still can (forgetting all the other indian languages in the process by the way)
Not enough..not even close.
...
Yep, there has to be more than meets the eye. I find it practically impossible that the decision makers at verisign could have such poor business acumen. They pretty much decided that they want the company to have less revenue.
__________________
NativeDomains.com
XBuild.com
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 25th July 2012, 03:31 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: The Golden West
Posts: 921
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 3240
Avtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the rough
Re: Internet Adds More Domain Names

If I try, I can come up with explanations for just about everything Verisign did. Not sure I believe what I'm saying though. Here is my case for Verisign (based on absolutely no information from Verisign):

Q: Why didn't Verisign push ICANN to have a fast track for the IDN equivalents of .com and .net?
A: Verisign's big money maker, and number one priority, is the .com/.net contract. They wanted to keep a low profile on other issues in order not to rock this boat. Even so, Chuck Gomes tried to push the idea of "non-detrimental string similarity", so that Russian .ком would not be in contention with Greek .κομ. This very reasonable effort failed, despite Chuck's deep familiarity with ICANN and its processes.

Q: Why did Verisign choose to apply for transliterations of .com and .net instead of translations?
A: They realized that a monopoly on the sounds "com" and "net" would be easiest to defend. They didn't want to end up in a contention set with .biz, .llc, .inc, .company, .network, .web, and their non-English equivalents.

Q: Why didn't Verisign apply for .公司 (company in Chinese)?
A: It's not a sound translation of .com. Plus they didn't want to do anything that would annoy the Chinese government, because they didn't want to create a new opponent to their existing .com monopoly.

Q: Why did Verisign apply for such strange Chinese strings?
A: They would have preferred something closer in sound to "com" and "net", but the current gTLD process doesn't allow single-character TLDs.

Q: Why didn't Verisign apply for .нет (Russian transliteration of net)?
A: The Russian word нет (pronounced "nyet") means "no". Too confusing.

Q: Why did Verisign apply for so few IDN transliterations of .com and .net?
A: Besides the expense, they were worried about technical issues. For instance, if/when IDN.com is aliased to IDN.com-in-IDN, there are changes that will need to be made at the registrar level as well as the registry level to implement this. Better to work through the issues on a limited set of TLDs. Plus there is no risk that someone else will snatch the transliterations in other scripts; Verisign's IP rights to these are easy to understand and easy to defend.

Q: Why is Verisign waiting until its applications are approved before explaining how aliasing will work?
A: I have no idea.

That's the optimist's case (again, I emphasize that I made up the answers to these questions without any input from Verisign). The pessimist's case (which I hope is wrong) is that Verisign has gotten big and dumb.

Time will tell.

Avtal
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 25th July 2012, 05:03 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: alburrica
Posts: 230
iTrader: (14)
Rep Power: 464
camarro is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: Internet Adds More Domain Names

Quote:
Originally Posted by squirrel View Post
I'm surprised by your post. You seemed reasonably sure in the past that indic languages would not be applied for by Verisign in the 1st round, except perhaps Hindi -and Tamil-. So the current situation can't be much of a let down for you, can it ?

Also I'm always a bit surprised when people critize Verisign for its dealing with ICANN. I personally did my best to engage with ICANN and its various instances on many occasions and it's very difficult to get something going. It sure looks like Verisign isn't doing much with respect to IDNs but it doesn't mean they haven't tried. Same goes for PIR by the way.. anyhow, it's very difficult for me to think that guys like Chuck Gomes and Ram Mohan aren't fully invested in making IDNs a commercial success.

PS: The single char TLDs issue is the reason VRSN hasn't been pushing for IDN gTLD fastrack in my opinion.
You or me beeing ignored as individuals when dealing with organizations like ICANN is the norm here, it's what to be expected unfortunately.
Verisign is verisign...and that's a whole different show, you can't really compare what's not comparable.
I find it hard to believe that they did all that they could do...but i don't dismiss what you are saying. Maybe they did tried....maybe they tried and this is all that they could get, that is a possible scenario that i don't discard completely...for the MAJOR languages, not for the lack of applications of "smaller" ones.
This is peanuts to them, they could have applied for at least twice that many languages and maybe run a few of them at a loss in the first years and still make a ton of money....and maybe even be pleasantly surprised by one or two of them.

They didn't. They have chosen the easy way. They've gone for the sure thing.

Regarding indian languages, you're right....it isn't a big let down for me (altrough i would be a happier man if two or three of them were there)
Ever since the number of applications was revealed a while ago by verisign it was clear that most of them would not make it to round one...so no surprises there. But i guess it is a big let down to the more than half indian population that doesn't have hindi as a first language...it will be hard to explain to one of them why has verisign applied for two extensions in hindi and not even one in their native language. This is a virgin market...if they wanted to take a shot at India why not take some chances?
Indian languanges is the most clear example for verisign lack of audacity in this process....but there are others. There is Greek...there is Georgian...there is Armenian
Dont get me wrong, like i said in another thread...this was overall good news, and we're looking a lot better now than we did a year ago...but considering all that it could be one has to wonder the choices that were made by verisign.
Conservadorism usually isn't a good idea in big business... fortunately for verisign they have a inimitable brand, but they are not alone in the market...ccTLD's are going to be there for the pickings.
Time will tell if their lack of vision today will not cost them important markets tomorrow.

...
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 26th July 2012, 12:03 AM
Drewbert's Avatar
Administrator
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 6,091
iTrader: (20)
Rep Power: 0
Drewbert is a tad dodgyDrewbert is a tad dodgyDrewbert is a tad dodgyDrewbert is a tad dodgyDrewbert is a tad dodgyDrewbert is a tad dodgyDrewbert is a tad dodgy
Re: Internet Adds More Domain Names

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avtal View Post
If I try, I can come up with explanations for just about everything Verisign did. Not sure I believe what I'm saying though. Here is my case for Verisign (based on absolutely no information from Verisign):
Good post.
__________________
It's all jaded style to me.
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 26th July 2012, 01:14 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: The Golden West
Posts: 921
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 3240
Avtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the roughAvtal is a jewel in the rough
Re: Internet Adds More Domain Names

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drewbert View Post
Good post.
Thanks!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT. The time now is 11:29 PM.

Site Sponsors
Your ad here
buy t-shirt
מחיר הזהב

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0
Copyright idnforums.com 2005

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54