TM issue or good find?

[domainstosell]

I just reg'd a couple of Portuguese domains, but I'm not sure if they are TM issues, or if it was a good catch/good reg. I'm at work right now, so I can't really check out the possibly existing site that these may emulate. Anyway, here are the sites, please let me know what you think:

Orgías69.com
3241 BR OVT w/ext!
522 Google.pt for "Orgías 69"
51,000 Google.pt for "Orgías69.com"

Orgías69.net
4,529 BR OVT w/ext!
522 Google.pt for "Orgías 69"
564 Google.pt for "Orgías69.net"

A couple of other points/questions:

* It basically means "Orgies 69" so is this a generic enough term or idea or whatever to be considered generic?

* If it is a TM issue, what makes it so? Is it automatically a TM issue because the site is operating under that name, but w/out the accent mark? Doesn't that make it a typo (my domains)? And if that is the case, then does a site like "Cars.com" automatically have rights to "Cars.com" in every language?

Thanks in advance for your comments, thoughts, etc.!

[IDNCowboy]

Originally Posted by domainstosell

I just reg'd a couple of Portuguese domains, but I'm not sure if they are TM issues, or if it was a good catch/good reg. I'm at work right now, so I can't really check out the possibly existing site that these may emulate. Anyway, here are the sites, please let me know what you think:

Orgías69.com
3241 BR OVT w/ext!
522 Google.pt for "Orgías 69"
51,000 Google.pt for "Orgías69.com"

Orgías69.net
4,529 BR OVT w/ext!
522 Google.pt for "Orgías 69"
564 Google.pt for "Orgías69.net"

A couple of other points/questions:

* It basically means "Orgies 69" so is this a generic enough term or idea or whatever to be considered generic?

* If it is a TM issue, what makes it so? Is it automatically a TM issue because the site is operating under that name, but w/out the accent mark? Doesn't that make it a typo (my domains)? And if that is the case, then does a site like "Cars.com" automatically have rights to "Cars.com" in every language?

Thanks in advance for your comments, thoughts, etc.!

There is a site on Orgias69.com without the accent. While the mass may disagree with me if I was the webmaster of that site I'd send you a C&D. People that work long and hard to establish their sites will likely get pissed at you. Whether they would win is another matter. Expect some hostility.

It is definitely my view. I have a few TM's on a few of my websites. People have done stuff like this in the past to me and they handed over the domain. ;-)

[domainstosell]

Originally Posted by Jeff

There is a site on Orgias69.com without the accent. While the mass may disagree with me if I was the webmaster of that site I'd send you a C&D. People that work long and hard to establish their sites will likely get pissed at you. Whether they would win is another matter. Expect some hostility.

It is definitely my view. I have a few TM's on a few of my websites. People have done stuff like this in the past to me and they handed over the domain. ;-)

Thanks Jeff,

So in your opinion, worst case scenario is that I will have to give up the domains? Do I face any other hurdles? Also, does anyone know if there is an actual, legally compelling reason that I would have to give them up? If I do get some kind of correspondence from the "other" site owners, I most likely wouldn't fight it; but is it a legal issue or just a moral/ethical issue?

[IDNCowboy]

Originally Posted by domainstosell

Thanks Jeff,

So in your opinion, worst case scenario is that I will have to give up the domains? Do I face any other hurdles? Also, does anyone know if there is an actual, legally compelling reason that I would have to give them up? If I do get some kind of correspondence from the "other" site owners, I most likely wouldn't fight it; but is it a legal issue or just a moral/ethical issue?

moral/ethical - you are profiting off of their own hard work in advertising the site.

[jose]

You can offer them the domain and expect some reward or... be an a* and cash on PPC while you can and them hand it over when they ask for it or... if you want to be a real pain in their asses, ask for $500. Much less than what they would spend on layers. It's not my idea, I've read this in here from a very promenint member....

I myself would do that! I would just park it and scare them with an email just before ie7 is launched and them offer them the domain. lol

[domainstosell]

Thanks for the advice guys... Call me a glutton for punishment, but I just got one more set (however, these seem to be an even more generic term):

VídeosDiários.com - Means Daily Videos in Spanish and Portuguese I think...
23,180 ES OVT
5,813 ES OVT w/ext
6,119 BR OVT (446 for vídeosdiários.com.br)

VídeosDiários.net
23,180 ES OVT
133 ES OVT w/ext
6,119 BR OVT
2,238 BR OVT w/ext

A couple more points:

*This seems to be a generic term, Daily Videos, does that make a difference? - Understand, I'm not trying to be a jerk and skate on people's work for my own benefit, but isn't this a similar situation to Asian sites that have been using the IDN url as an identifier without actually owning it? i.e. - someone buys the IDN and they get an influx of traffic from that established site? It is hard to pass up an open reg with these stats...

*Further complicating matters is this: different permutations of this name are owned with accents/no accents, so there are basically 4 different ways to type this name (if you include the ASCII version)... So isn't it more akin to a typo? Typos of major sites are listed all the time in DNJournal for $XXXX - $XXXXX and more...

[IDNCowboy]

Originally Posted by domainstosell

Thanks for the advice guys... Call me a glutton for punishment, but I just got one more set (however, these seem to be an even more generic term):

VídeosDiários.com - Means Daily Videos in Spanish and Portuguese I think...
23,180 ES OVT
5,813 ES OVT w/ext
6,119 BR OVT (446 for vídeosdiários.com.br)

VídeosDiários.net
23,180 ES OVT
133 ES OVT w/ext
6,119 BR OVT
2,238 BR OVT w/ext

A couple more points:

*This seems to be a generic term, Daily Videos, does that make a difference? - Understand, I'm not trying to be a jerk and skate on people's work for my own benefit, but isn't this a similar situation to Asian sites that have been using the IDN url as an identifier without actually owning it? i.e. - someone buys the IDN and they get an influx of traffic from that established site? It is hard to pass up an open reg with these stats...

*Further complicating matters is this: different permutations of this name are owned with accents/no accents, so there are basically 4 different ways to type this name (if you include the ASCII version)... So isn't it more akin to a typo? Typos of major sites are listed all the time in DNJournal for $XXXX - $XXXXX and more...

If you say that Daily Videos is generic then you're going to have to say every domain name in the world is generic. Two generics can be a trademark ;-). The websites I have tmed are made up of two generic words

What about IBM? (international business machines) etc

[domainstosell]

Originally Posted by Jeff

If you say that Daily Videos is generic then you're going to have to say every domain name in the world is generic. Two generics can be a trademark ;-). The websites I have tmed are made up of two generic words

What about IBM? (international business machines) etc

Thanks Jeff,

I guess that goes back to my other question: Can (for example) Cars.com make a claim on Carros.com or 車.com?

Or, for another example, does Facebook.com have a claim on Faceboook.com (reported sale on DNJournal at $9,200)?

Aren't these domains (VídeosDiários.com, VideosDiários.com, etc) more along the lines of typos?

These topics are just a point of debate.

I want to be honest in my work (but like I said, it is hard to pass by an open reg with these stats...)

[IDNCowboy]

Originally Posted by domainstosell

Thanks Jeff,

I guess that goes back to my other question: Can (for example) Cars.com make a claim on Carros.com or 車.com?

Or, for another example, does Facebook.com have a claim on Faceboook.com (reported sale on DNJournal at $9,200)?

Aren't these domains (VídeosDiários.com, VideosDiários.com, etc) more along the lines of typos?

These topics are just a point of debate.

I want to be honest in my work (but like I said, it is hard to pass by an open reg with these stats...)

The issue whether ascii .com owners would get the foreign equivalent was discussed. This was the opinion of the ascii domain holders which was considered VERY extreme. These names will never go to them. Perhaps some companies might try to claim them but they'll have a hard case to prove.

MySpace.com if you look on dnforum has sent C&D's to many domains that are mispellings of myspace. Most of the time the name has been turned over to them.

When a domain has that much typin ovt it could be the case that there is a TM on the domain. Not necessarily saying there is but when it seems that established it would pretty much be foolish not to have a TM on your business name.

[domainstosell]

Originally Posted by Jeff

The issue whether ascii .com owners would get the foreign equivalent was discussed. This was the opinion of the ascii domain holders which was considered VERY extreme. These names will never go to them. Perhaps some companies might try to claim them but they'll have a hard case to prove.

MySpace.com if you look on dnforum has sent C&D's to many domains that are mispellings of myspace. Most of the time the name has been turned over to them.

When a domain has that much typin ovt it could be the case that there is a TM on the domain. Not necessarily saying there is but when it seems that established it would pretty much be foolish not to have a TM on your business name.

Thanks Jeff, all good points.

Now I guess I need to decide what exactly to do with these names...

[Drewbert]

Originally Posted by domainstosell

Aren't these domains (VídeosDiários.com, VideosDiários.com, etc) more along the lines of typos?

Errr, no!

Your domains are the CORRECT representation in Portuguese.

THEIR domains without the accents are TYPOS.

Send THEM a C&D.

[Rubber Duck]

Originally Posted by Drewbert

Errr, no!

Your domains are the CORRECT representation in Portuguese.

THEIR domains without the accents are TYPOS.

Send THEM a C&D.

Yes that is an interesting point. A typosquatters is regarded as having registered in bad faith. Correct spellings cannot be typos can they. This is going to be a messy area for someone to clear up.

[domainstosell]

Originally Posted by Drewbert

Errr, no!

Your domains are the CORRECT representation in Portuguese.

THEIR domains without the accents are TYPOS.

Send THEM a C&D.

That is a great point; I never thought about it that way, but it really makes sense...

Thanks for the viewpoint!