IDNForum Korean name sold for 2K

[Lmg67]

Hi, just an FYI that I sold:

xn--ok0bx68b.com (윪기.com) - organic - CORRECTION - 유기.com

for $2,000. It's a very popular word in Korea, I was told. $2k isn't that much relatively speaking but it's enough to get the sale AND IDNForum mentioned in the DNJournal, so that's good! (I told them the venue of sale was IDNForum so I hope they'll include that information.)

Have a good weekend!
Laurie

[jose]

No OVT.... NO Google?!?!?

[touchring]

No OVT.... NO Google?!?!?

LOL. You underpriced your names!

[gammascalper]

Puny is different from unicode.

I think Lmg67 meant this 유기.com

[Goodtime]

Yes I think so,

유기 is organic, and to other meaning is kind of Korean traditional metal vessel.

[jose]

Yet... 유기 only 6000 ovt... Korean Domains rocks... check my auction, lol.

On a serious note: I wish I had researched Korean domains sooner. But the real truth is that the open code punnycode encoder used by everyone (including IDNF) had a serious bug, on the Korean chars encoding! It was fixed recently.

[touchring]

Me too, it seems that valuation has increased tremendously.

[thefabfive]

Maybe time to sell SouthKorea, touchring. Sell high and all...

[burnsinternet]

Congrats, Laurie! I know you are keeping some good ones for yourself, too.

Your list of private sales are beginning to make me wonder why you stay under the radar. Stay there as long as you can....

[Drewbert]

But the real truth is that the open code punnycode encoder used by everyone (including IDNF) had a serious bug, on the Korean chars encoding! It was fixed recently.

That may explain why there were so many crap Korean IDN's regged by (even) Koreans in the early days.

Have you got any tech info about the bug? Who found it?

Cheers,

[touchring]

Darn, made me go and check my names. Ok, they are real.

Does it affect every korean word or only some?

[jose]

That may explain why there were so many crap Korean IDN's regged by (even) Koreans in the early days.

Have you got any tech info about the bug? Who found it?

Cheers,

I DID! My exchange of mails with Matthias Sommerfeld (phlyLabs.de) about that:

-------------------
Me: tagged with ">"
Matthias: not tagged with ">"
---------------------------

> Try with 가가. Your app gives xn--ypda40ab instead of xn--o39aa.com!
-------------------------------------------------------------------

I decided to use the "official" VeriSign tool here http://mct.verisign-grs.com/index.shtml

to be really sure not to run into bugs anywhere else.
Unfortunately they also come up with your result. I guess, I will have to dig very deep in my source code to find the mistake. Most probably it is some issue with the fact, that PHP calculates with floating point numbers whereas C and C++ do use real integers.

> Is there a way around this?! Your app is very, very popular; I wonder how no one has found this before?!
Korean stabds out in the Unicode standard, since the characters need to be normalized in a very special way nearly no other language needs. So all the German, Russian, Japanese,... people out there would never run into this. I'll come back to you once I found the bug, but this may take its time.

-------------------------------------------------------------------
I've been working all night comparing RFCs word by word with what I hacked together, and now think, that I tracked down, what was wrong.
Please find attached a new version of the IDN class, which should handle Hangul syllables correctly now.

Please feel free to give it some hard tests ;)
-------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Thanks very much for the hard working debugging it.
>
> You've asked me to do some hard tests and so I did. I am sorry to say,
> but it is still buggy. Check, for instance, 대출.
> Your code gives xn--yud7073f5xqa.com and should be xn--vk1bq81c.com

I can reproduce this, but am not sure yet, what causes this. I'll look into it the next days.

-------------------------------------------------------------------
> BTW: Have you ever fixed the Korean encoding problem?

Yes, at least I think so. The current version 0.5.1 has fixes for the Hangul syllable composition, which should clean that up.


Feel free to add my REP power. Thanks.

[Drewbert]

Yikes.

Was it making the same error going in the other direction? puny->unicode?

Does this mean that php driven sites like NameDrive may have been serving up the wrong characters for korean IDN's?

How about php driven registrars like Dynadot?

[touchring]

I checked my lot, registered last March-May, they are all ok. I remembered checking kr whois as well, so they can't be wrong at the same time. My earliest kr name was dec 2005, that's ok as well.

False alarm? :)

[gammascalper]

Bram's idntools.net is fine.

(thumbup)

Well spotted Jose.

[Lmg67]

Thanks Burnsinternet!! Hey I like your new avatar!

[sunsei21]

wow i really let that name go to cheap what was i thinking congrats on the sale :) :) im kicking myself btw

[Lmg67]

Remember that "cooking class" in Korean recently sold for $5,000, and "cell phone" for $36,000!!! When I posted my Korean names at DNForum, a Korean guy PM'd me and congratulated me on having "organic," saying it is a very popular word in Korea.

I would have held on to it for more money, but I needed IDN renewal money...so it was a win-win situation for both me and the buyer.

[sunsei21]

well im glad you made out well with it as i was debating on dropping it lol wtf was i thinking again congrats :)

[Lmg67]

Remember that "cooking class" in Korean recently sold for $5,000, and "cell phone" for $36,000!!! When I posted my Korean names at DNForum, a Korean guy PM'd me and congratulated me on having "organic," saying it is a very popular word in Korea.

I would have held on to it for more money now or in the future, but I needed IDN renewal money...so it was a win-win situation for both me and the buyer.

I always believe that all IDNers are on the same side as each other, cheering each other on, and it doesn't seem right to me that when someone makes a nice sale, and one that will be in DNJournal as an IDNForum sale, that others make fun of it. And it's not WHAT is said, it's HOW it's said.

[touchring]

Maybe time to sell SouthKorea, touchring. Sell high and all...


I'm holding on to my korean names as i do not have many.

[clipper]

Congrats on the sale, lmg.:)

The recent activity in Koreans has led me to register some I've been sitting on. If anyone can help please see my thread (forthcoming edit).

[Rubber Duck]

I'm holding on to my korean names as i do not have many.

Not sure I understand the logic here.

Korea is a small nation, but pretty technically advanced and an early adopter of IDN. This means that valuation in Korea IDN are running ahead of other much more economically significant countries, with greater potential growth prospects.

I don't have any Korean, we let the few we had drop, as the quality was pretty modest. However, if I were getting solid offers on Korean names now, I would definitely be looking to sell to pick up names cheaply in other markets.

Domains in Japanese, Chinese, Russian and Arabic, will all be worth more than Korean, when the markets mature.

[burnsinternet]

I think it is just a sign of things to come, RD.

I am receiving unsolicited offers for "small country" local domains at much higher amounts than I would have imagined. I can't seem to give away the domains that I thought would sell well.

If the small population, wired, wealthy countries are starting to notice, just wait until Japan wakes up. And that might just be the big warmup for the rising prices of the rest of the big countries.

Thanks Burnsinternet!! Hey I like your new avatar!

Thanks, Laurie. I was feeling a little racy tonight. :p

[Rubber Duck]

I think it is just a sign of things to come, RD.

I am receiving unsolicited offers for "small country" local domains at much higher amounts than I would have imagined. I can't seem to give away the domains that I thought would sell well.

If the small population, wired, wealthy countries are starting to notice, just wait until Japan wakes up. And that might just be the big warmup for the rising prices of the rest of the big countries.



Thanks, Laurie. I was feeling a little racy tonight. :p

Markets are very immature. Plenty of opportunities for arbitrage. If the offers seem high in regard to the rest of your portfolio, it is likely that you are in a better position to make judgement calls than the buyers.

We are largely international players. Domestic players much like all those infuriating ASCIIers will be one trick ponies. There will be Korean speculators who are only interested in Korean, but if their money is good, then you can put it to work elsewhere.

Yes, these are the murmurings before an Earthquake.

[burnsinternet]

Of course, when a puzzling high offer comes in for a Swedish, Bulgarian, or Greek mid-level name, I sell without a regret. I have renewal fees in the mid $xx,xxx range to offset. If the buyers resell for more, good for them!

[clipper]

Not sure I understand the logic here.

...

Domains in Japanese, Chinese, Russian and Arabic, will all be worth more than Korean, when the markets mature.

I concur, but let's just congratulate lmg, and look forward to the things to come.:)

[burnsinternet]

I concur, but let's just congratulate lmg, and look forward to the things to come.:)

Amen, brother!

[Rubber Duck]

I concur, but let's just congratulate lmg, and look forward to the things to come.:)

Agreed congratulations, I was only trying to advise people to look seriously at selling Korean if the offers are on the table. There is more latent value in the market elsewhere. Same applies to Hebrew. If you have hold Hebrew, then sell it and buy Arabic. Just look at the maps, both demographic, and mineral resources. There is no way that long-term Hebrew is going to fetch higher prices than Arabic. These are just market anomalies.

[burnsinternet]

Again, I don't think they are anomalies. I think they are harbingers of the much anticipated IDN price inflation. Some said that the tokyo.net sale was an anomaly.

[domainguru]

Not sure I understand the logic here.

Korea is a small nation, but pretty technically advanced and an early adopter of IDN. This means that valuation in Korea IDN are running ahead of other much more economically significant countries, with greater potential growth prospects.

I don't have any Korean, we let the few we had drop, as the quality was pretty modest. However, if I were getting solid offers on Korean names now, I would definitely be looking to sell to pick up names cheaply in other markets.

Domains in Japanese, Chinese, Russian and Arabic, will all be worth more than Korean, when the markets mature.

The word "pretty" is a pretty big understatement here. South Korea is pretty much the world's most wired nation. Online trends that spread round Asia more often than not originate in Korea, moreso than Japan or China. The big pan-Asian pop stars are pretty much all Korean these days. If I had any decent Korean names, I wouldn't be selling any until the market had matured a further 12 months. Korean IDNs could be the most valuable of all.

[Rubber Duck]

Again, I don't think they are anomalies. I think they are harbingers of the much anticipated IDN price inflation. Some said that the tokyo.net sale was an anomaly.

I don't think that we are in fundamental disagreement here. Yes, this is a sign of things to come, but if you could sell Korean, and pick up several Japanese or Chinese of similar quality, you would undoubtedly come out ahead in the longer-term.

Domain value is ultimately proportional to market reach. The larger the slice of a market, and the larger the value of that market, then the more a domain is worth. It is therefore inconceivable that sustainable long-term value in Korean are going to be higher than Chinese or Japanese, unless the latter just decide that they are more comfortable with English. These Korean sales are only a spark of the detonator of the mega-ton explosion that is little more than a heart-beat away. Yes, Korean names are going to be worth a lot more than they are now, but whereas these names have the potential to go up tenfold, other names out there have the potential to go up a hundredfold or even a thousand times what they are currently fetching.

Yes, if you have a house or a grandmother or other assets you can raise cash against, that probably makes more sense than selling your Korean, but if you have little cash then selling Korean to buy even better in other languages has to make sense.

[Asiaplay]

Congratulations....

Couple comments....

Korean has a very high level of users per capita (and outstanding web penetration ) as a market.... also most Koreans over mid 20's have non-existent levels of English. This helps drive IDNs.

In regards to pricing levels...
I have noticed that a lot (I mean really a lot) of the .kr versions of good Korean IDNs are held by staff of the registrar companies... i.e. educated sellers of IDNs.

When my Korean friend contacted one or two of them on my behalf... enquiring on a couple of IDNs - they quoted me 2 million won consistently (which is about the same as US$2000)...
My guess is these quassi registrar owners position of setting prices at this level (and not really moving much below) is what is stabilising (stabilizing) the market there (therefore was interested to see this is the price you almost exactly matched with your sale).

But once again - I see .kr as more valuable than .com etc. etc. (should be little discounting as goes down to dot .la haha - like from 2000 to 0 :) )...
Couple of comments so you can get an idea where you perhaps should possibly be starting (as a minimum) in discussions for Korean IDNs you know are good ones.

Hope comments of 1% use to someone...

Cheers, Asiaplay

PS: unless selling to me of course (then $10 would be great place to start ;) lol)

[touchring]

Selling a name or two in any language is no harm. Diversificatin is always fun. Arbitraging is even more fun! :)

[IDNCowboy]

You guys really think .kr is going to be better? It sucks cause its impossible for us to get idn .kr - besides all the best are regged...

burns where are you quoted $2000? Everyone has quoted me $100,000-$500,000 usd lol

[bwhhisc]

You guys really think .kr is going to be better? It sucks cause its impossible for us to get idn .kr - besides all the best are regged...

burns where are you quoted $2000? Everyone has quoted me $100,000-$500,000 usd lol

That was Asiaplay that mentioned $2k.

[Asiaplay]

Logic of .kr being better is due to what people have been finding on Search engine results (this is a debatable argument & I am not trying to pretend I am an expert on this - so decide for yourself, if this logic is true...)

Namely that for .kr to show in results in Korea, it can be hosted anywhere in the world (assuming ok speeds to Korea)... however, to ensure that .com appears on Korean results in Korea you may need to / must host the domain in Korea (and possibly also put down a Korean address for IDNs whois).

As you know, hosting in Korea can be as big a hassle as buying .kr domains
(and personally I would prefer to be hosting a .kr where-ever I liked... rather than forced onto a Korean server... saying this... I may have no choice, as I can not afford or get some of the Korean IDNs I want).
I am taking the approach of using a trusted friend to hold Korean IDNs for me - but not everyone has this option (and I am unsure if paying the higher price to e3 and trusting them to never run away with an IDN is a good option - not tried them).

The only other possibility is nationalism... and the natural feeling that Koreans may have, in regards to feeling safe to buy off a Korean company (which sort of means .kr to a degree, since others find them hard IDNs to buy).

Just general discussion from me... as I say I am still learning myself :)....

Cheers - Asiaplay

[IDNCowboy]

Logic of .kr being better is due to what people have been finding on Search engine results (this is a debatable argument & I am not trying to pretend I am an expert on this - so decide for yourself, if this logic is true...)

Namely that for .kr to show in results in Korea, it can be hosted anywhere in the world (assuming ok speeds to Korea)... however, to ensure that .com appears on Korean results in Korea you may need to / must host the domain in Korea (and possibly also put down a Korean address for IDNs whois).

As you know, hosting in Korea can be as big a hassle as buying .kr domains
(and personally I would prefer to be hosting a .kr where-ever I liked... rather than forced onto a Korean server... saying this... I may have no choice, as I can not afford or get some of the Korean IDNs I want).
I am taking the approach of using a trusted friend to hold Korean IDNs for me - but not everyone has this option (and I am unsure if paying the higher price to e3 and trusting them to never run away with an IDN is a good option - not tried them).

The only other possibility is nationalism... and the natural feeling that Koreans may have, in regards to feeling safe to buy off a Korean company (which sort of means .kr to a degree, since others find them hard IDNs to buy).

Just general discussion from me... as I say I am still learning myself :)....

Cheers - Asiaplay
asiaplay, have you noticed all the korean names going on snap? The .com's are going for $x,xxx minimum. A bunch of the bidders live in korea.

[Asiaplay]

I haven't checked - but my guess is this is as the .kr equivalent is long, long gone (being used by a serious related company who will never release it).

But it is true - I am not saying that .com is not desirable (it is!!!)... it is solely due to hosting issues that I personally prefer the .kr option (but for Koreans hosting in Korea, this is a non-issue)...

Traded figures are also more likely to be .coms as you say - as I guess the majority of IDNs owned outside of Korea are .com (and very few are .kr).

Guess is time for me to stop commenting now - lol... really I am not an expert - was just sharing couple of things in case anyone thought comments are useful.

Thanks - Asiaplay

[KorDom]

Hello,

I am new member. I am from Korea.

I saw this sale and need to reply.

We do not use the word '유기' for meaning organic. We use '유기농'.

유기 mean like metal bowl or something like this. It is traditional bowl and not common used in our house.

I hope buyer do not think they buy 'organic.com' for Korea language. It is not correct.

If you do google.co.kr search with 유기농 you can see first website is organic.co.kr

Please be careful with Korea language it is difficult for translation to English sometime.

[rhys]

Welcome KorDom. We sure do need more Korean IDNers on this forum!

[touchring]

Please be careful with Korea language it is difficult for translation to English sometime.

Looks like google translation failed thnis time.