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Olney
12th September 2005, 11:13 PM
I was wondering since domain names could be .jp .com .net or .cn
When registering IDNs which ext takes dominance?
Initially I assumed that if I take a Japanese term like テレビゲーム TV Game

We own the .com www.テレビゲーム.com (http://www.テレビゲーム.com) & another company owns the .jp with the same keyword テレビゲーム.jp

When you type in the term without the extension in a browser where does it go?

Does it get directed to the .jp which is a native Japan extension or does it generally go to the .com

Seeing that this term is searched for over 700,000 times a month it's very important to see when type in traffic develops more which term will get the traffic when people don't type the extension.

The Winner Is

Our テレビゲーム.com IS THE WINNER

That means that even for IDNs .com extension takes dominance if you type in the keyword term without the extension
Currently type in traffic is still low but will grow as people get used to knowing they can use native Japanese domain names.

Rubber Duck
13th September 2005, 01:54 PM
They will only ever be able to do this when they have an IDN enabled browser. This is why the EI 7.0 launch is so important. Not only will the biggest player Microsoft have adopted the IDN standard, or more accurately supported it, but it will Automatic Download where XP Service Pack 2 is already installed. This means the roll out could beat all previous records!

Once this happens it is a fair bet that type-in the far-east will explode!

Best Regards
Dave Wrixon

rolf
13th September 2005, 07:55 PM
Indeed, .com's have recently been the default for non-IDN domains, when typing in a keyword and no extension. I initially thought this was a great thing, but the public seem to be quite educated enough to always use an extension.

Although there are no stats that I have found, I am willing to bet that most type-in domains include the extension.

Still, in IDN terms you could easily see a trend where locals really take to IDNs, and don't wish to advertise or publicise with the extension, they may prefer to just use the local characters and attempt to "reeducate" the public. This way, no roman characters are necessary.

It needs someone big to push it though, in my opinion.

donwebcorleone
29th January 2006, 11:07 AM
Olney, i know u did this post several months ago, but i still wonder if you or someone have gained me some experience on this issue. which one is more important .jp or .com? japanese being very nationalistic, when most users will know they can also type in Japanese, i think will go for .jp The publicity on magazines or tv seems to impulse a .jp culture instead of .com (most associated with english websites) . Pick up any main japanese newspaper nowadays and it seems this is the current trend, even when until now most website are in alphabet "japan.jp" instead of IDN "日本.jp"

Im right or wrong according to the CRT that u guys have in your many IDNs? .com or .jp ? japan nationalism and publicity gives the belief that the .jp is the winner :confused:

and well im also beginng to guess some japanese will create a firefox extension so that the relevance with typing goes to .jp or that when u search something on the net the first categories/websites must be .jp to be sure is in japanese. just my guess, but am i too wrong with your actual CRT on .com vs .jp in IDNs?


I was wondering since domain names could be .jp .com .net or .cn
When registering IDNs which ext takes dominance?
We own the .com www.テレビゲーム.com (http://www.テレビゲーム.com) & another company owns the .jp with the same keyword テレビゲーム.jp
When you type in the term without the extension in a browser where does it go?
Does it get directed to the .jp which is a native Japan extension or does it generally go to the .com Our テレビゲーム.com IS THE WINNER
That means that even for IDNs .com extension takes dominance if you type in the keyword term without the extension. Currently type in traffic is still low but will grow as people get used to knowing they can use native Japanese domain names.

donwebcorleone
29th January 2006, 11:58 AM
another thing that reinforce my idea of that .jp is becoming the winner in japan is the fact the most famous websites are .jp ; u have to remember yahoo jp, google jp, livedoor jp, apple jp so u are beginning to associate the idea a website in japanese is the one in .jp and that a website that is not .jp is in english, french, spanish, etc.

now second thing is that the use of the cellphone email address which for most japanese means their main email and all of them are .jp , so u ask an email and u know at the end will be a .jp

third thing, when buying domains dont forget that in japan there is formal and informal japanese, so if u are using an online dictorionary u r right the word is correct and it will show a good OVT (newspapers, etc tend to focus on formal japnese) but search for the casual japanese and i m sure it ll have better OVT specially when you are aiming to young japanese. lets say there are many kinds of ways to say a word and among young people the least formal is their favorite.

anyway thats why am i thinking to buy only .jp, but it is logical what i do? im thinking to go for an IDN .com only if i cant find the .jp Do you guys do the same?

Rubber Duck
29th January 2006, 12:26 PM
another thing that reinforce my idea of that .jp is becoming the winner in japan is the fact the most famous websites are .jp ; u have to remember yahoo jp, google jp, livedoor jp, apple jp so u are beginning to associate the idea a website in japanese is the one in .jp and that a website that is not .jp is in english, french, spanish, etc.

now second thing is that the use of the cellphone email address which for most japanese means their main email and all of them are .jp , so u ask an email and u know at the end will be a .jp

third thing, when buying domains dont forget that in japan there is formal and informal japanese, so if u are using an online dictorionary u r right the word is correct and it will show a good OVT (newspapers, etc tend to focus on formal japnese) but search for the casual japanese and i m sure it ll have better OVT specially when you are aiming to young japanese. lets say there are many kinds of ways to say a word and among young people the least formal is their favorite.

anyway thats why am i thinking to buy only .jp, but it is logical what i do? im thinking to go for an IDN .com only if i cant find the .jp Do you guys do the same?

I am a dot commer. Dot Coms are cheap and easy to trade. Statistics also show that Japanese have registered more dot com than dot JP, in both conventional and IDN domains. The main thing against .jp is that most establish site are actually co.jp. When they migrate, which I think they will with IDN, then they obviously they have to choose a new extension. In China, it is noticeable, I believe, that companies are migrating from ASCII.com.cn to IDN.com rather than IDN.cn. My guess is that there will be a similar trend in Japan. But it is a guess and no more than that. You live there, so you should be able to better market research than I can. I have never even been there once.

At the end of the day Great Generics will be in great demand in both extensions. Prices? Well that is another matter, but as dot coms are a lot cheaper, you are going to have to sell for much more on a dot JP to make the same return. Having said that if this difference is between increasing your capital 1000 fold instead of a 10,000 fold, then it is probably not too serious.

We are arguing about the width of smile!

Dave

Olney
29th January 2006, 12:39 PM
Being in the market for a little I came to realize the Japanese registry will ONLY promote buying 日本.jp because they don't make a dime off of 日本語.coms
It's premature to say which is better.
The registry will only promote jp though cause it's in their best interest.

As long as people keep aware that they can buy both both will do very well.

I'm developing some of my IDN domains to keep users aware....
This is part of the total plan...

Jackal
29th January 2006, 01:36 PM
I was wondering since domain names could be .jp .com .net or .cn
When registering IDNs which ext takes dominance?
Initially I assumed that if I take a Japanese term like テレビゲーム TV Game

We own the .com www.テレビゲーム.com (http://www.テレビゲーム.com) & another company owns the .jp with the same keyword テレビゲーム.jp

When you type in the term without the extension in a browser where does it go?

Does it get directed to the .jp which is a native Japan extension or does it generally go to the .com

Seeing that this term is searched for over 700,000 times a month it's very important to see when type in traffic develops more which term will get the traffic when people don't type the extension.

The Winner Is

Our テレビゲーム.com IS THE WINNER

That means that even for IDNs .com extension takes dominance if you type in the keyword term without the extension
Currently type in traffic is still low but will grow as people get used to knowing they can use native Japanese domain names.

.... and the percentage of the people typing-in without the extension?

Olney
29th January 2006, 01:56 PM
Actually things have changed since I first wrote this thread.
Google invested in Firefox

Instead of going to the .com of what you type in now everything goes to the first listing on Google...

We'll see how it goes on IE7

donwebcorleone
29th January 2006, 02:16 PM
I am a dot commer. Dot Coms are cheap and easy to trade. Statistics also show that Japanese have registered more dot com than dot JP, in both conventional and IDN domains. Dave

Dave, you are the man. but let me express my opinion and tell me what u think about it , ok? because i believe that if people wanna keep for a long time a japanese IDN then keep .jp instead of .com

The statistics dont count on this issue, reason? who cared about a .jp when the .com started? everyone in Japan believed that if u wanted a presense on the internet, then u need a .com, it was a .com world/business after all? but well if u manage to translate the website of the .jp registration organization, you will see the exponential growth of .jp in the last year. Nowdays there is a change and i guess final one, this change will be that .jp means japanese business and in japanese. (im not talking about type-in which until now it seems to be more profitable on .com but if u wanna sell domains to japanese people the .jp means japan . Then why to buy a .com to sell stuff in japanese?)

remember japan is super nationalistic and IDN will reinforce that, the same that is ocurring with the .de market (if in japan hasnt ocurred yet the same was because www.japan.jp was still in alphabet) Now japanse have the IDN tool that was the needed key element to exploit the .jp domain. remember english is not the forte of japanese or chinese. It was way too difficult to go from kanji to alphabet and besides that, it requiered to know the meaning of the words as it was the .com case.

Who knows maybe im too newbie on IDN but best advice to anyone trading with .jp is buy an airticket and come to japan for a week. Check publicity, grab some tissues (most famous advertizing tool in Japan), etc and begin to check what domains websites the young generation are prefering to use or register for their blogs, homapages, etc., check what domains are the music stores, fashion shops, etc are using in Shibuya (area of Tokyo for young people), Ginza (the area of design clothes, etc), Akihabara (electrodomestics, games, anime) and then a domainer can tell better where to put the eggs.

anoher main thing in Japan that people abroad cant see, is that the internet in japan is going to "cell phone websites" instead of "pc websites" with the obvious .jp domain. In the latest cellphones from Docomo, AU, etc u can play games, watch movies, watch tv, download songs, listen the radio, etc, etc. Yahoo Japan and any big domain have both sites, "pc and cell phone websites". If you live abroad u cant know this and find it too hard to believe, but well Japan uses the latest technology in cell phones G4, USA is still G2. Another relevant thing when thinking about internet in Japan and what will mean online presence in the a few years (pc vs. cell phones websites)

After all the IDN decision (.jp vs .com) will be determined by what the japanese (and not the .com businessmen), and who use the internet the most is obviously the young people. It is difficult to tell where is the future of the japan internet business is going front being in front of a computer, even when it seems stupid. but if you are in real state, dont u wanna see the property before to buy it?

anyway as someone who studies in Todai, i wanted to explain better my point. So what do u think? pure crap or there is some interesting idea on what i said?

ps. this "article" should go to dnjournal! ; )

Olney
29th January 2006, 02:29 PM
I personally think a lot of your points are valid but this IDN world is not going to be defined by just young people.

Basically people are not going to say I'm not going to put up a dot com because it's not a dot jp...

The research I'm doing on IDN domains & SEO will hold more prevelant.
People are going to get used to see IDN domains through search results first.

I already have a few popping up in search results.

Also the fact that many premium IDN domains are reserved by the Japan registry makes the dot com version the only option sometimes. I think both of us (me & Dave) say it's really hard for any of us to say what will be better for users when we still have to make people aware.

Japanese people buy dot jps because unlike the dot com market what they actually want is available this is also a big deciding factor. The regular dot coms & regular dot jps are not on equal playing fields.

IDN jp & IDN com are....

Jackal
29th January 2006, 02:30 PM
Actually things have changed since I first wrote this thread.
Google invested in Firefox

Instead of going to the .com of what you type in now everything goes to the first listing on Google...

We'll see how it goes on IE7

Thank you for the clarification.

donwebcorleone
29th January 2006, 02:52 PM
I personally think a lot of your points are valid but this IDN world is not going to be defined by just young people.
Also the fact that many premium IDN domains are reserved by the Japan registry makes the dot com version the only option sometimes.

IDN jp & IDN com are....

i agree, though i was trying to show my position why i believe as someone living in japan that the winner will be .jp After all many members dont know japanese or doesnt live in Japan to know why Yahoo Japan is more important than Google, why Ebay couldnt get any big marketshare in Japan, etc. In fact u got a big point in there that supports my belief, the japanese government determine strongly the policies for companies and they support 100% .jp as u read on the open letter they sent to Microsoft.

As they feel that the technology is ready, all that bureaucratic aparatus will force the e-business in Japan to adopt or switch to .jp as the main standart to reinforce the presence of Japan in the internet. Japanese politicians and business dislike a lot the fact that .jp isn`t a famous or hot domain worldwide. I guess those premium IDN domains u mentioned will be available later this year or as soon IDN is a mature tool.

Olney
29th January 2006, 03:48 PM
There is no forcing in this situation. Companies have a choice when it comes to their website names. I've been researching this from day one coming back to Tokyo in September.
Look at the Yamanote line & you will see an array of extensions from co.jp to .com (If they could get them) & dot jp.

There is absolutely no way the registry will be able to keep IDN dot coms from being as popular as soon as people know they both are available people will choice to buy one or the either. I mean realistically dot nets are not a bad option either.

I work for a pretty large SEO company & see what the major corporations are choicing everyday plus I am consulting my own personal clients. I've been part of Japan's internet develoment since 1999. Me making this site an expanding a new market wouldn't surprise a lot of people who knew me.

We can't base anything on Japan Registry because they can only promote dot jps. They are not the only company though. The smaller registries are promoting what they can equally. It's marketing like McDonald's advertising burgers.. No they advertise their burgers.

My main point is we can't say which is going to dominate completely until IE7 is launched.

In the members section is the complete list of reserved dot jps. I didn't go through it to see why the dot jps are reserved but I believe they wanted them for themselves. I truly believe that they will both be pretty equal now....

Once you start buying a lot & realize like me that the Japanese registry is also snatching up dot com drops as quick as I was you'll realize that they are as equal...

I lost ケータイ.com by like an hour to one of them.... This was the same day I got Anime.com & haken.com It's only the official Japan registry that will only promote dot jp every other authority will buy & sell both. Look at Yahoo Auction Japan...

There's plenty of dot com IDNs for sale as well as jps...

kenne
29th January 2006, 04:52 PM
Great discussions!

Olney:
"In the members section is the complete list of reserved dot jps. I didn't go through it to see why the dot jps are reserved but I believe they wanted them for themselves. I truly believe that they will both be pretty equal now...."

Where's that thread?

DonWebCorleone raised some interesting questions:
I suppose the docomo and mobile phone browsers already support IDN right?

Also, switching between IDN into nonIDN extension, is it easy to do on cellphone?

Are there screenshots of docomo and mobile phone browsers reading IDN web sites?

Thanks everyone!

Rubber Duck
29th January 2006, 05:17 PM
Interesting discussion.

I cannot add very much but would be interested on any additional information relating to mobile browsing with IDN. This is not just a Japanese issue.

I think both extensions will be greatly used, and would not try to dissuade anyone investing in either.

Best Regards
Dave Wrixon

touchring
29th January 2006, 08:18 PM
I agree with the nationalistic viewpoint, except there's 1 difference - the japanese do not have an unpleasant view of America - .com symbolizes America to some German people. Asians tend to have a positive view of american stuff, mcdonalds, disneyland, hollywood, etc.

I would tend to think that .jp is going to be worth as much or slightly more than .com, but definitely not 60/6.99 = 8.5 times more.

However, if you are looking into investing more than $500 in a japanese idn, the $60 a year might be a non-issue. :-D

rhys
31st January 2006, 07:03 PM
Great discussions!

DonWebCorleone raised some interesting questions:
I suppose the docomo and mobile phone browsers already support IDN right?

Also, switching between IDN into nonIDN extension, is it easy to do on cellphone?

Are there screenshots of docomo and mobile phone browsers reading IDN web sites?

Thanks everyone!

Kenne's questions here are key. We need some data so we don't just continue the armchair philosophy exercise we are currently embarked upon. I'm including myself as an armchair philosopher because I just don't know. But I strongly believe that the mobile experience in Japan will greatly "define" the Japanese type-in habit. So to that end - DonWebCorleone or Olney would tell us more about mobile phone browsers, their capabilities, the UX (user experience), and whether sites or more .com than .jp?

gammascalper
31st January 2006, 07:11 PM
You're right rhys.

It will depend on the sites that come on stream. If all that's at the end of .coms are parking pages, and .jp is associated with developed sites, then collective user habit will surely be defined by the experience.

Who knows how this develops.

Rubber Duck
31st January 2006, 07:20 PM
As far as the business of Firefox and IE 7.0 adding extensions to enquiries in the address bar, I feel that with the introduction on DName Aliasing and all the possibilities that this presents, then this corruption of the User request in the address bar will have to be stamped out, or the user experience will be greatly diminished.

I have to agree with the contributors below who state that established site with content will draw traffic and will reinforce user habits. This in turn will influence the domains market.

Dave

donwebcorleone
31st January 2006, 08:53 PM
regarding mobile browser, i think the best person to give you insight is Olney as he does SEO and webdesign. the only thing i can say is that almost all are .jp (in fact all i know are .jp but maybe Olney knows some .com) The mobile browser depends on the company (docomo, au or vodafone) but they do can support IDN as you can see in the picture below (i cant say all companies, since i dont have a cell phone from the 3 companies, right?) i also think u can download Opera mobile browser which also support IDN, but i havent download it or seen anyone with it. i hope this stuff helps you but really Olney is the man for UX, SEO on mobile websites, etc.

And adding more points to the .jp vs. .com, as i stated above .jp for me is the winner. IMHO I said to Jeff that .jp will mean for most japanese (as the japanese government supports) the idea that buying in a domain .jp is a secure move, because it brings the "feeling" of "trust", that is controlled by the japanese government and a business done by japanese. I even risk to say in some time IDN .com will be in a few years symbol of scam. And based on my super brief experience of my first two days selling IDNs, when i offered IDN .com vs. .jp people were interested to develop a website with the .jp i guess because what im saying customer will know that a .jp will be in japanese, no more "unpleasant" landings in english or who knows which language websites ; ) i think IMHO again that any other IDN extension can be good to get revenue by ads whether is .com, .ru, .tw, .us but it seems .jp will be the winner to sell an IDN for content in a few years.

By the way, an ad in a store of an IDN, and guess what? it is a .jp I found these pics on the net, perhaps u can fnd more.

http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/9822/picture24vc.png

http://img464.imageshack.us/img464/4963/picture37hp.png

touchring
31st January 2006, 09:06 PM
I guess the issue is not whether .jp is better than .com for Dave, but return on capital - it costs many times more to register a .jp than a .com, so if 生茶.com ($6.99) can fetch $1000, Dave won't invest in 生茶.jp unless it can fetch at least $2000 - $3000.

Myself, i got another reason not to focus on buying .jp - i am also actively buying European, Arabic and Korean idns, so i need to conserve capital, especially when i intend to hold for up to 5 years for some of them.

btw, what do you think of my 日本.tv? Costs about the same as a .jp for the 1st year.

Rubber Duck
31st January 2006, 10:49 PM
Yes, as you say, it is a question of risk and return. Dot JP hasn't proved a winner over dot com in ASCII and it is certainly not clear that it will with IDN. At nearly 10 times the cost of a dot com and with ease of transfer etc for me it still has a lot to prove. However, I am not saying they won't be used. They may even be more successful than dot com, but for a speculator, I feel it unlikely that they will yield a higher return.

Dave

kenne
1st February 2006, 12:16 AM
Don, This is amazing. Wish I got a vacation to go to Japan. It looks like on the cellphone photo, .jp extension is hardcoded (or defaulted). I hope the Japanese at least know how to toggle it to other tld extension?

Also, what ratio of internet access is by cellphone vs by pc? I can't imagine people doing EVERYTHING on that tiny screen!

rhys
1st February 2006, 02:59 AM
Don, This is amazing. Wish I got a vacation to go to Japan. It looks like on the cellphone photo, .jp extension is hardcoded (or defaulted). I hope the Japanese at least know how to toggle it to other tld extension?

Also, what ratio of internet access is by cellphone vs by pc? I can't imagine people doing EVERYTHING on that tiny screen!

I noticed that too. Which of the 3 services is that picture? Olney & Edward are other mobile service hard coded .jp too? How hard is it to toggle?

touchring
1st February 2006, 03:48 AM
I noticed that too. Which of the 3 services is that picture? Olney & Edward are other mobile service hard coded .jp too? How hard is it to toggle?

Hard to believe that .jp is hardcoded when almost every japanese website i have visited so far that uses ctld use .co.jp? :-D

gammascalper
1st February 2006, 04:01 AM
Good point re: .co.jp

It kind of looks like a mockup of a screen not an actual screen.

In any case, it still needs to shake out with important sites... get some of both extension -- and don't worry!

touchring
1st February 2006, 04:09 AM
Yup, i think we sort of confused .co.jp with .jp. .com is definitely no match for .co.jp. :-D

Olney
1st February 2006, 04:21 AM
Ok I'll add my input to this.
As I said before Japan registry registers .jp they don't make a dime from .coms

On the phone that picture is from the imode menu.
I believe that site is supported by the Japan Registry since I saw it initially on their page.

What they did was made a site that forwards you to a dot jp IDN domain.

Since they are the Japan registry of course the site was approved by Docomo.

It's going to be preference in what people buy as the market isn't open. To say one will equal scam is a big thing to say.

This is my point to speculate based on what is being promoted in Japan by the Japanese registry means to just give up. I'll own a few popular IDN dot coms that I'm working on now. Will they equal scam because they are dot coms, no.

I actually do have large connection with the Japanese mass media especially youth media. If someone is going to promote using IDNs in whole in Japan it's going to be me, not just IDN jps but IDN domains.

It's people's choice to register & buy what they want. I just focus on Japan IDN domains coms & jp whereever I see fit. We'll see both being sold & developed.

Japan doesn't know completely about IDN domains yet it is just too soon to say they won't know or use coms at all. It's just too early.

Once someone makes a huge portal site with an easy to brand IDN domain dot com or dot jp & people know they can use them the trend will continue.

I believe I have that power, along with the connections in Japan to create at least a few.

True if we leave it to the Japan Registry they will only promote jps like on that site they fund but they are not the sites people are going to to buy domains. Onamae.com & Other registries promote both.

touchring
1st February 2006, 04:34 AM
I believe promoting idns in japan will be a little tricky since so many websites brand themselves using kanji.com, like that kakaku.com, and people know it's fake, and they will tend to think real idns are fake as well. :p

donwebcorleone
1st February 2006, 04:37 AM
it seems some of you are never happy. you guys ask if IDN works on mobile browers, i took time and i answered your question. now regarding the photo, i cant tell which company phone is that one i said i found it on the net on the website of a japanese registrar as u read above. There are hundreds of phones in each company, with new ones release like every 3 months, do u expect me to know all the phones by 3 companies to tell that the photo is the cellphone from Docomo XXZA released on April 4, 2004 or to be even more specific? besides that photo i found it on the information of the registrar to explain mobile browsing, but i guess now u guys want photos of all the phones available in Japan, now? Stop complaining, if you dont like it, come to Japan and find the information you want yourself. :mad: ; (

donwebcorleone
1st February 2006, 04:40 AM
and for the record, i said olney is the master here in SEO and mobile browsing, but in my cellphone of the company i use i got the extension by some "autofill" function. okay? i cant say all phones have this extension autofill. Good luck! and wait for Olney to reply you.

Edwin
1st February 2006, 04:45 AM
It looks like the phone is already on "Site A", a site that allows IDNs to be typed in easily to go to Sites B, C, D etc. I know of no such ".jp" setting by default.

Olney
1st February 2006, 04:48 AM
The history of the dot jp.

The reason why companies in Japan are buying dot jps are because they used to have no choice at all in the matter. That's why there are a few guidelines & restriction for dot jps.

All the good dot coms are gone, all the easy to remember dot coms are all gone. This is the fundamentals behind us buying IDN domains in general. People in other countries don't have a big choice.

When it came to the dot jps Japanese companies could actually register the domains they wanted. They still are registering dot coms if available.

When it comes to IDN domains Japanese have even more choice in the matter because they are now able to register IDN com IDN net IDN jp. No other people use this characterset (except Chinese) so the chance of getting what they really want is even more. For the IDN market initially it will be the IDN keyword that will have the most weight. dot com can't equal scam if it's a true Japanese word think about. Other than us on this board scammers are not yet fluent in Japanese.

I mean the whole domain market in Japan is undeveloped. Try to keep unbiased & open. Being biased & saying what won't work in an undeveloped market will hinder progress...

I'll put it this way. In one aspect I was told アニメ.com was worth registration fee do you think so? That was someone who limited his thinking.

I can develop IDN sites, I can get high rankings for dot coms or dot jps. Initially I want to concentrate on high ranking keywords. For the search engines this is what will matter. Not the extension. Once I get some press for the things I'm developing people will NOT think it's a scam just because one site might be a dot com if in Japanese it will only be regarded as a Japanese website.

donwebcorleone
1st February 2006, 05:12 AM
of course your アニメ is great, i love anime!!!! thats why u know i asked you the price to consider buying it to use it on an anime club or something it but i also wanted to contact the the one who owns .jp to have both and avoid confunsion by transfering the traffic from .com to the .jp but Anyway i have always said for me is this or that... everyone can judge what is best for its portafolio. for instance, one IDN that i also contacted a member is the one by gmmalscpaper, he has テニス.jp

by the way, why edwin or olney try to explain the infrared aspect of cellphones i dont speak english that well to know even how to call this technology, i think that is also relevant regarding mobile browsing; i mean the posters, vending machines, "links" in pc websites, information booths, etc that i point my cellphone to the ".jp website link -black box photo below" and it sends me directly to their website on the cellphone browser.Or is this kind of tech as well in other countries mobile internet services?

anyway, im having lunch and going soon to another meeting, this time at the Ministry of Technology to get more information about trademarks/.jp from the position of the government. It doesnt hurt to be cautious.

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/2917/picture40gc.png

Olney
1st February 2006, 05:20 AM
That's great research & of course I do respect your opinions. I also want say this did make excellent discussion on the subject.

donwebcorleone
1st February 2006, 05:31 AM
i think the technology is called mobile access is in english, what i find it important is because for instance if on the "pc website" of www.yahoo.co.jp says download a song for your cellphone, their mobile website http://yahoo.jp i think this is very important, since u find this infrared black boxs everywhere and the landing website on the cellphone will be a .jp as in yahoo japan. I said this because of the debate on which one gets more momemtum on internet on japan .jp or .com

here is the whole pic of the photo, so u can read the steps on how it works

http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/712/picture65wv.png

Edwin
1st February 2006, 06:44 AM
It's called qrcode and it's not magically limited to .jp...
http://www.denso-wave.com/qrcode/index-e.html
http://qrcode.jp/

rhys
1st February 2006, 02:53 PM
i think the technology is called mobile access is in english, what i find it important is because for instance if on the "pc website" of www.yahoo.co.jp says download a song for your cellphone, their mobile website http://yahoo.jp i think this is very important, since u find this infrared black boxs everywhere and the landing website on the cellphone will be a .jp as in yahoo japan. I said this because of the debate on which one gets more momemtum on internet on japan .jp or .com

here is the whole pic of the photo, so u can read the steps on how it works

http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/712/picture65wv.png

Is this read by cellphone via infrared? Or is this a 2D barcode which makes use of the camera built into cellphones as an input device? And Don thanks for all the pictures - they really make some of this more tangible for discussion.

donwebcorleone
1st February 2006, 05:22 PM
i cant reply your question well, because i dont know whats 2D? maybe the other members who live in japan know 2D to give the correct reply.

by the way, to the members that wanna know more about japanese cellphones and mobile internet browsing u can check the link below. this is the easiest website of a cellphone i found if u dont speak japanese. Just click on pc-mail, full browsing, etc and then give a few seconds to load; click on the "black tiny box- " and later keep checking one by one in the japanese sentences to watch the feauture on each category. I hope u guys find this useful to understand better how the latest japanese cellphones work. Check on which of your browsers work better or loads faster.

http://www.nttdocomo.co.jp/product/business_model/m1000/special/index_flash.html

http://img56.imageshack.us/img56/4466/picture16ee.png

this is how the opera browser in this phone looks. i didnt know that in latest phones by Docomo u can also use with Opera 7.5, thats gorgeous, i ll switch cellphone company to get this Docomo! ; )

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/8750/picture25yn.png

touchring
1st February 2006, 06:04 PM
Truly impressive. The GSM companies totally screwed up the mobile internet browsing experience.

kenne
1st February 2006, 06:30 PM
Great Stuff Don, Thanks for the pointer and pics!

I'm wondering what yahoo.jp search result looks in the cellphone browsers. since they make money by sponsored ads, they must put the sponsored ads on the page, but that probably leaves little room for non-sponsored ads.

If they give more prominence to sponsored ads, then that will greatly help the sponsored ads market (more money to us traffic domainers).

On the other hand, if they give more prominence to natural search results, that will really hurt the sponsored ads market (assuming japanese do mainly use cellphone browsers). That indirectly will hurt traffic domains.

So how the search engine companies make this UI decision is very important. I'd also like to confirm the ratio of japanese usage of cellphone vs pc.

My own ingrained habit is: cellphone would be used more for routine tasks, while pc would used for exploration and more complicated task.

Is this also true with Japanese?

Rubber Duck
1st February 2006, 06:44 PM
Great Stuff Don, Thanks for the pointer and pics!

I'm wondering what yahoo.jp search result looks in the cellphone browsers. since they make money by sponsored ads, they must put the sponsored ads on the page, but that probably leaves little room for non-sponsored ads.

If they give more prominence to sponsored ads, then that will greatly help the sponsored ads market (more money to us traffic domainers).

On the other hand, if they give more prominence to natural search results, that will really hurt the sponsored ads market (assuming japanese do mainly use cellphone browsers). That indirectly will hurt traffic domains.

So how the search engine companies make this UI decision is very important. I'd also like to confirm the ratio of japanese usage of cellphone vs pc.

My own ingrained habit is: cellphone would be used more for routine tasks, while pc would used for exploration and more complicated task.

Is this also true with Japanese?

Hanzi and Kanji have a huge advantage in the respect as the informaton density is very much higher than for Latin, Arabic, Russian or Hiranjana.

Dave

donwebcorleone
1st February 2006, 07:53 PM
i think i m not the best person to know the exact percentage people use mobile internet instead of pc internet, maybe Olney has that information. but i think is still very low because dont believe guys everyone have this kind of super fancy phones. That docomo cellphone is very new, but thats why i think it is better to get an idea of the road that cellphone companies are taking.

another basic ideas of what u can do with latest cellphones in japan u can get it from seeing this simple but useful flash page here
http://www.nttdocomo.com/corebiz/interconnected/icw.html; just know that again not everyone owns one, or that some of these services are still on trial. Just click on Service, Network or Function using your common sense.